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Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/18/2008 4:39:41 PM
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Rufas2000
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I was reading a thread on another forum that talked about all Walmart stores being open on Thanksgiving (as opposed to only the Supercenters as in previous years). So I was wondering what people think of department stores, discount stores, drug stores, grocery stores, restaurants, movie rental places and other non essential businesses being open for the two remaining real national holidays (the other holidays still have most people working)? A few thoughts:
I used to be real rabid about this issue (thinking no one should be open). I still wish they weren't but I'm not so extreme about it. I don't really blame the businesses, their job is to make money. I personally will not go to a store on Thanksgiving or Christmas. I don't want to encourage stores to be open on those days. But thats just me.
I see why grocery stores open on Thanksgiving but I wish they would close at Noon instead of 5 PM. If you don't have it by noon do without. The cashier that takes your money won't spend Thanksgiving with their family at all. Seems to be a bigger sacrifice than going without cranberry sauce.
Movie rentals are the most annoying to me, rent it the day before. and while most businesses are good about closing on Christmas Eve at a decent hour (6 or 7 PM) Blockbuster stays open to 10 PM. Not much time for Mom to spend with the little ones. And they reopen at Noon on Christmas Day. Would it be any big loss to open at 2 or 3 PM? Do people really need to rent movies right at 12 PM? At least let the poor employees have Christmas dinner with their families. Again though the business is doing what they can to turn a profit. If people weren't buying (or renting) they wouldn't be open.
I give an exemption to 24 hour stores. If you're open at 3 AM on March 15 then you earn the right to be open on 3 AM December 25. But I commend Walmart for closing all Supercenters at 6 PM on December 24 and reopening December 26 at 6 AM. I suppose some place has to be open for emergency items.
Anyway those are my thoughts. I'm looking forward to hearing other perspectives. I would request the following:
In the Walmart thread I mentioned earlier some made the point that if emergency services had to work why not them. I hope the people here would refrain from such a comparison as it is pointless. We need emergency workers, we can do without movie rentals. Two totally different situations.
If you are not big on Thanksgiving and/or Christmas please keep in mind as you're responding that you probably don't understand how important it is to those who celebrate it. So yoy wouldn't find it a big deal to have to work on a day you find meaningless.
BTW: if this should be in another forum please move it there.
Thanks.
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/18/2008 4:48:50 PM
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stellaluna
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I've always been grateful for anything that stayed open on a major holiday because for many many years I had to work on holidays. It was so helpful to have a restaurant to go to or grocery store or whatever, just in case you needed something.
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/18/2008 10:54:54 PM
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tomhillbilly
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i have no family so this part of the question isnt an issue for me. Celebrating holidays is totally a personal choice as far as im concerned. I dont see the point of lobbying for everything to be closed for everyone just because they want to make two days family days.
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/18/2008 11:35:23 PM
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Rufas2000
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quote:
Celebrating holidays is totally a personal choice as far as im concerned.
The "personal choice" for these employees is work on these days or be fired. If they have the option not to work then I'm fine with it.
quote:
I dont see the point of lobbying for everything to be closed for everyone just because they want to make two days family days.
So people can have that "personal choice" you mentioned to celebrate or not. Emergency services I can see but I don't think Kmart or Blockbuster being open on Thanksgiving is improving anyone's quality of life. Just go the next day, everyone else does.
By the way, I think we need more "family days" not less. Having to work on holidays isn't a factor in the decline of the family but that and the overall attitude of work needs before family certainly is not helping.
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 2:59:48 AM
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Bluethread
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Rufas2000
quote:
Celebrating holidays is totally a personal choice as far as im concerned.
The "personal choice" for these employees is work on these days or be fired. If they have the option not to work then I'm fine with it.
Then do you believe we should all get to choose when we work without being required to negotiate with our employers.
quote:
quote:
I dont see the point of lobbying for everything to be closed for everyone just because they want to make two days family days.
So people can have that "personal choice" you mentioned to celebrate or not. Emergency services I can see but I don't think Kmart or Blockbuster being open on Thanksgiving is improving anyone's quality of life. Just go the next day, everyone else does.
By the way, I think we need more "family days" not less. Having to work on holidays isn't a factor in the decline of the family but that and the overall attitude of work needs before family certainly is not helping.
If one were to observe the biblical holy days, one would have even more family time, but there are a relative few who believe stores should be closed on those days. Having to negotiate with one's employer is pretty common among those who wish time off for Adonai's appointed times. Welcome to my world.
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 6:51:10 AM
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Rufas2000
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quote:
Then do you believe we should all get to choose when we work without being required to negotiate with our employers.
No but it would be nice if employers would be sensitive to their employees' desires to have these two traditional days off. We are talking two days out of 365.
quote:
If one were to observe the biblical holy days, one would have even more family time, but there are a relative few who believe stores should be closed on those days. Having to negotiate with one's employer is pretty common among those who wish time off for Adonai's appointed times. Welcome to my world.
I think there are relatively few people who observe those days. Which means your employer should make every effort to give you those days off. By giving you the day off, it makes you a happier, better employee so it benefits them as well. So I support you in that. Because of the relatively few people who celebrate the Biblical holy days a business closing is unnecessary.
BTW: Christmas & Thanksgiving IMHO have little to no religious or Christian significance, at least in the way they are traditionally "observed". Though many people do add it in their own ways
But again I'm not laying this at the employer's feet but rather I'm wondering if shopping at Kmart (or anywhere) on Thanksgiving day is so important that we would be willing to cause people to miss a day which they look forward to with family and friends. There are only two of them now as it is, soon there may be no days where most stores are closed.
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 8:20:52 AM
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P31W
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All holidays are the big boom days for Casino's.
We each vote with our money. If you don't like something then don't give them your money. If you like something then give them your money.
I don't like gambling so I give them none of my money. I don't like places being open on holidays so I don't give them my money on those days.
It's really the general public who decides what places will be open and which will be closed.
It use to be the Chruch crowd that kept certain eating establishments open in my area years ago on Sundays. Without that group giving them money they would have just not opened on Sundays.
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 8:35:58 AM
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StephK
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I don't have a problem with them being open on the holidays. It's obvious that many others don't mind it either. I believe part of the reason is that for some people that is the only time they have to go shopping because they work all the time at their jobs. Retailers see a business opportunity and are taking it. If it wasn't profitable they wouldn't open.
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The heart of the wise inclines to the right but the heart of the fool to the left.
Even as he walks along the road, the fool lacks sense and shows everyone how stupid he is. ~ Ecc. 10:2-3
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 9:25:05 AM
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garsyt
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Most stores that are open on the holidays are running with a bare bones staff. At my local Blockbuster (I KNOW because I asked yesterday when I returned some movies) will be open on Thanksgiving day but their employees that will be working that day are single college students that are not able to drive home for Thanksgiving anyway. They took volunteers to work Thanksgiving and the same goes for Christmas Eve. Here the store is closed ALL day on Christmas Day. The incentive is double time on their paycheck, but if spending time with ones family holds a greater priority then extra money on the paycheck wouldn't matter.
I personally am very happy that a local Walgreens is up and running on Thanksgiving and Christmas day, complete with pharmacy hours! Nothing scarier that looking into the face of an asthmatic having an attack and realizing that you may not have enough medication to make it through the day. If the pharmacy had not been open that day I would have likely spent my Christmas sitting in a hospitals ER.
Blessings,
Garsy
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 9:28:05 AM
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zoebob
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I'm starting to pay attention around here. McDonalds will be closed on THanksgiving and Christmas. CLose at 7 on CE.
When I have worked at places that were open on those days they tried to schedule people for whom it wasn't so upsetting to work. For example, teen agers didn't necessarily mind working on Christmas but wanted New Year's Eve off. Parents didn't mind working NYE so much though but wanted Christmas off.
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 10:09:10 AM
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Rufas2000
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I personally have no problem with a business being open if there are workers who don't mind working. Its good to know that these situations are working themselves out. I love the Holidays and I thank God I have never had to work a Thanksgiving or Christmas day (though too many Christmas Eves).
quote:
complete with pharmacy hours!
Yeah it kinda sticks in my craw that drug stores were open on the holidays but the major useful service they provide (picking up prescriptions) was unavailable. Not that I want pharmacy workers to work holidays but if they are going to be open they should provide those needed medicines.
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 10:12:54 AM
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Rufas2000
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quote:
It's really the general public who decides what places will be open and which will be closed.
Exactly my point.
Its really a matter of each person's conscience and consideration for the desires of others. If anyone feels they need to go to a store on Thanksgiving then go. Just be aware that your choice is causing at least some of the workers to miss their holiday. Obviously a serious situation where you need something for safety's sake is well worth the store being open.
I'm just saying ....
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 10:52:31 AM
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Rufas2000
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quote:
I'm sure you'd be unhappy if your local hospitals, fire departments, police departments, etc. closed on Thanksgiving and Christmas. You can argue that they provide a public service or they are there for our well-being, etc. but that doesn't mean that the ER nurse or police officer wants to be at work instead of with their families. Shouldn't they be able to go home just because they want to?
As I mentioned in my first post there is a difference between emergency workers providing needed services and cashiers being available to ring up your Big Lots stuff. One is necessary for the public good, the other is not. I should hope that obvious.
To quote from my childhood: one of these things is not like the other ... 
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 10:56:36 AM
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P31W
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quote:
To quote from my childhood: one of these things is not like the other
ROFL you take me back to a simpler time. A time when I didn't have to think about "should I shop on Christmas day"....... LOL
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 11:18:20 AM
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kernsfamily
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When I was in college, I would ride down with my mom and dad to North Carolina for a few days (we lived in Detroit at the time), to see my sisters who had recently moved to North Carolina.
Typically, we would LEAVE to go down there on Christmas Day. .....and be able to drive most of the way that first day. Thank goodness, along the way, many stores and restaurants were open!
As with restaurants and such....MANY people do work on those holidays....our neighbor, who is a trauma surgeon at a major hospital here, those working in "public safety" roles, and around here we have a number of "semiconductor fab" facilities. Operations at places like that run 24/7, as it is extremely difficult to just turn them "off"....they most likely "eat out"....
In 1992 and 1993, I lived in North Carolina, and worked at RDU Int'l Airport...the stores/restaurants and airport operations there had to be open, as well.
More than once, especially if we had "thanksgiving dinner" at about NOON, or so....by about 7pm we'd get hungry (but, not really wanting MORE turkey)....so, we'll order a little bit of Dominos pizza!
as for our family....we've opted to "eat out" on Thanksgiving (my wife kids and my parents together).....have turkey and all the trimmings at a nice restaurant, and be able to enjoy our time together...instead of having my wife and mom slave in the kitchen all day......sure makes sense to me!
As most everyone said.....if all those stores DID open, and NO ONE came and bought anything.....then, they would make the decision to be closed.
thank goodness we have a "free market" system today (weren't there alot of laws in the "old days" dictating to stores WHEN they could be open?)....in which stores and restaurants can CHOOSE to be open on whatever days they wish.
Another thought: In our urban, metropolitan area....there is ALOT of diversity.....while we are celebrating Christmas and everything....it's not a "holiday" for EVERYONE....and, many of those not celebrating "Christmas" would rather work!
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 11:19:08 AM
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tomhillbilly
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The big point is that it isnt a big deal not to be able to shop a couple days out of the year. I agree with you completely rufas. Lets consider one thing about "families" and single people (like me). Simply, families get all the benefits and single people get none. Whats worse is that single people not only receive no thanx, but generally are treated as some sort of outcasts.
Whether its everyone wanting to save seats everywhere,church included, paying taxes for other peoples families or being shuffled around on the job to accomodate "family days" and family problems.
maybe it wouldnt kill family people to show a little appreciation and not just a sense of entitlement.
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 11:23:12 AM
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kernsfamily
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Rufas2000
quote:
It's really the general public who decides what places will be open and which will be closed.
Exactly my point.
Its really a matter of each person's conscience and consideration for the desires of others. If anyone feels they need to go to a store on Thanksgiving then go. Just be aware that your choice is causing at least some of the workers to miss their holiday. Obviously a serious situation where you need something for safety's sake is well worth the store being open.
I'm just saying ....
so, there's something "wrong" with my wife and I packing up the kids to go to the movies on thanksgiving....to get them out of the house for the afternoon? It is after all a "day off" of work for me....and time to spend with kids and family the way we wish.
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Blessed to have all of them in a "totally awesome" public elementary school!
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 11:25:33 AM
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Rufas2000
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quote:
I think you didn't read my post closely enough.
Or perhaps you haven't completely gotten my point. Which is this: think about the fact that someone else is having to work to provide you with the service. If you are comfortable that whatever you are wanting to do is worth someone missing their holiday then go for it. A medical emergency qualifies. A criminal incident qualifies. I have no problem asking someone from those departments to work on Christmas to preserve life and limb. I cannot say its OK in my heart for someone to work so I can buy some stuff or even that last little thing that'll make the Thanksgiving feast complete. Because the person that rings me up won't have a feast at all.
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 11:31:02 AM
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Rufas2000
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quote:
so, there's something "wrong" with my wife and I packing up the kids to go to the movies on thanksgiving....to get them out of the house for the afternoon? It is after all a "day off" of work for me....and time to spend with kids and family the way we wish.
That's up to you. If you feel its OK then who am I to say. I'm just presenting the other side of it, from the perspective of those who are missing out on a holiday celebration (which is more meaningful than a "day off") so you can take your family to the movies.
You'll also note I never said anything about movie theaters. Going to the movies on a holiday cannot be replicated in another way so I'm not really getting into that. Movie rentals are another story, just rent them the day before.
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 11:39:37 AM
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lexie
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quote:
Another thought: In our urban, metropolitan area....there is ALOT of diversity.....while we are celebrating Christmas and everything....it's not a "holiday" for EVERYONE....and, many of those not celebrating "Christmas" would rather work!
Most places in my neighbourhood will be open on Christmas, since most people in my neighbourhood aren't Christian. I don't see anything wrong with that.
I don't see why it's a big deal with people working on these holidays. Maybe there's a difference in labour laws, but here, if someone works on a statuatory holiday, they must first agree in writing to it. Then they have a choice if they want to take holiday pay or regulary pay and a substitute day off. So when I go to Blockbuster on Christmas (since we don't celebrate it in the typical ways) I don't feel bad for the person who is renting me the movie, because they either agreed to work or they don't know their rights as an employee. (And I typically ask them which it is.)
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 11:51:50 AM
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kernsfamily
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quote:
I'm just presenting the other side of it, from the perspective of those who are missing out on a holiday celebration (which is more meaningful than a "day off") so you can take your family to the movies.
who's saying anyone is really "missing out"?
They CHOSE to work at a business that is open on holidays/weekends/sundays and the such.
If they really don't want to work holidays, then, there are plenty of other stores and businesses out there who are KNOWN for staying closed on those days. They can certainly CHOOSE to work at those businesses.
Back when I worked as a server at a restaurant....I worked all sorts of holidays. Didn't think anything of it. I knew what their hours/days of operation were....and, that they were open to serve people on Thanksgiving and Christmas. (and, on both of those days, we were fairly busy!)....not EVERYONE wants to cook a big, huge dinner for everyone on the holidays.
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Blessed to have all of them in a "totally awesome" public elementary school!
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 12:29:33 PM
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stellaluna
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I'm basically saying what lexie and kernsfamily are saying. I can't think of a job that won't tell you up front that working holidays may be part of the deal. If you are dead set against working a holiday, then don't take the job.
Conversely, the idea that people like nurses, doctors, firefighters, etc. are graciously giving up their "family time" to make sure you're safe is a stretch. I know plenty of them that hate it and will fight like crazy to NOT be the one working.
quote:
Or perhaps you haven't completely gotten my point. Which is this: think about the fact that someone else is having to work to provide you with the service. If you are comfortable that whatever you are wanting to do is worth someone missing their holiday then go for it. A medical emergency qualifies. A criminal incident qualifies. I have no problem asking someone from those departments to work on Christmas to preserve life and limb. I cannot say its OK in my heart for someone to work so I can buy some stuff or even that last little thing that'll make the Thanksgiving feast complete. Because the person that rings me up won't have a feast at all.
I think you're just making assumptions and a bigger deal than it is. Some people will have their celebration earlier or later, some don't care to have one, some don't care about family time at all, some want the extra cash.
For several years I was forced to celebrate Thanksgiving with my family after the fact. Why? Because my brothers were playing college basketball and there was always a tournament on Thanksgiving. I would submit to you that all sports should be banned on holidays, along with any other television programs (because someone has to work pushing all those buttons and tuning in satellites), and there shouldn't be parades, because those people need to be home with their families, not waving at strangers and those strangers should be at home, too, having turkey and not waiting for candy to be thrown at them and and and...
Which things do you intend to boycott because you think people are missing their family time?
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RE: Stores Open on Thanksgiving or Christmas - 11/19/2008 12:52:35 PM
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P31W
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quote:
Which things do you intend to boycott because you think people are missing their family time?
I try to stay away from places of business and the doctor's office and the pharmacy and from unnecessary burning on the holidays and Sundays.
You may chose to not do this but some of us do. That does not make us evil people to try to think about others.
I know for most of my father's employees there was "no choice' about where they were going to work if they also wanted to feed their families. Having choices about when and where and how often to work for many people are not always optional. Those are more times than not optional for the wealthier members of a society.
I remember when they did away with our Sunday blue laws. The stupid girls in store where I worked helped to vote them down because they said, "Sunday is the only day we have off to shop with our husbands".
ROFL those girls were to ignorant to realize "we" were going to be the ones who worked on Sundays not our bosses.
< Message edited by P31W -- 11/19/2008 12:58:50 PM >
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