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ORIGINAL: Dubya

I agree with the assessment that we have allowed Christmas to become too commercialized and has made children focus on the wrong thing.

I disagree, however, with your statement that Christmas is somehow a fake holiday built on pagan traditions. The Christ Mass goes way back, at least to the fourth century. It was originally a celebration of the ministry of Christ and took place just after the first of the year. As Christianity spread through Europe priests worked to replace pagan traditions and holidays with Christian ones. Christmas is one of those Christian holidays which was adapted to pagan culture and tradition. The holiday was moved to December 25 to replace the winter solstice holiday. The whole object was to get the newly converted Christians to focus on Christ rather than their paan traditions.

It appears that in our "post-Christian" society the "priests"of atheism have decided to replace Christian holidays with non-Christian themes in an attempt to get our focus away from Christ.

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ORIGINAL: Bas

The feast of the nativity is NOT on the solstice. It's 3 days later. ;)

Christmas was the lessor holiday; Epiphany being the more important holiday--which involved the gift giving. Christmas started taking prominence much later.

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ORIGINAL: campbe33

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ORIGINAL: Bas

The feast of the nativity is NOT on the solstice. It's 3 days later. ;)

Christmas was the lessor holiday; Epiphany being the more important holiday--which involved the gift giving. Christmas started taking prominence much later.

Christ was not born anywhere near December, so why continue to perpetuate that lie. It was selected because it coincided with the idolatrous pagan festival Saturnalia—and this celebration must be carefully examined. In any event, we do not know the exact date of Christ's birth. While God certainly could have made it known, He chose to hide it from the world's eyes! Nowhere in the bible will find early Christians celebrating Christmas or Easter, so why do we do it now? These are nothing more than man-made holiday's. So as true Christians how can we celebrate them?

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ORIGINAL: Dubya

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ORIGINAL: campbe33

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ORIGINAL: Bas

The feast of the nativity is NOT on the solstice. It's 3 days later. ;)

Christmas was the lessor holiday; Epiphany being the more important holiday--which involved the gift giving. Christmas started taking prominence much later.

Christ was not born anywhere near December, so why continue to perpetuate that lie. It was selected because it coincided with the idolatrous pagan festival Saturnalia—and this celebration must be carefully examined. In any event, we do not know the exact date of Christ's birth. While God certainly could have made it known, He chose to hide it from the world's eyes! Nowhere in the bible will find early Christians celebrating Christmas or Easter, so why do we do it now? These are nothing more than man-made holiday's. So as true Christians how can we celebrate them?

Throughout the Bible, beginning in the Old Testament, certain significant events were commemorated with annual feast days or holidays. It is only a natural extention to set aside special days to commemorate the birth, life, and death of our Savior.

The earliest record of a celebration of the birth of Christ was in the fourth century after the Roman empire was converted to Christianity. I suspect that during the period of intense persecution in the late first century throught the middle of the fourth century that Christians had very little time to consider holidays or feast days.

While it is true that no one knows the exact date of Christ's birth, that should not stop faithful Christians from celebrating His birth. If tradition sets the date on December 25 - so be it. If that date coincides with a pagan tradition - so what? As long as it is Christ that is being celebrated what difference does it make?

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Christ was not born anywhere near December, so why continue to perpetuate that lie.

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ORIGINAL: Bas

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Christ was not born anywhere near December, so why continue to perpetuate that lie.

No informed person believe or teaches that Christ was actually born on December 25.

Basing the liturgical year on passover and the resurrection, which are fixed dates, the rest of the calendar was placed at the appropriate dates for an annual cycle.

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ORIGINAL: Bas

It's OK to cringe. You don't have to participate. ;)

However, I will continue to use the season as a commemoration of the incarnation. But I am liturgically oriented in general. I like celebrating stuff specifically.

Besides, there are all those great hymns. ;)

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I agree with the assessment that we have allowed Christmas to become too commercialized

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Thomas Paine asked this question a couple hundred years ago. He said he was good and he wasn't a christian so why couldn't everyone else be.

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To use it as celebration of Christ's incarnation is
wrong.

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ORIGINAL: campbe33
Yes, the were a lot Feast celebrated under the Old Testament Covenant that God directed the Hebrews to Celebrate. There are no new Feasts the Jews or Gentiles were directed to celebrate under the New Testament.

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So, do any of those Humanists tell us what they mean by "be good"?

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ORIGINAL: Dubya

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ORIGINAL: campbe33

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ORIGINAL: Bas

The feast of the nativity is NOT on the solstice. It's 3 days later. ;)

Christmas was the lessor holiday; Epiphany being the more important holiday--which involved the gift giving. Christmas started taking prominence much later.

Christ was not born anywhere near December, so why continue to perpetuate that lie. It was selected because it coincided with the idolatrous pagan festival Saturnalia—and this celebration must be carefully examined. In any event, we do not know the exact date of Christ's birth. While God certainly could have made it known, He chose to hide it from the world's eyes! Nowhere in the bible will find early Christians celebrating Christmas or Easter, so why do we do it now? These are nothing more than man-made holiday's. So as true Christians how can we celebrate them?

Throughout the Bible, beginning in the Old Testament, certain significant events were commemorated with annual feast days or holidays. It is only a natural extention to set aside special days to commemorate the birth, life, and death of our Savior.

The earliest record of a celebration of the birth of Christ was in the fourth century after the Roman empire was converted to Christianity. I suspect that during the period of intense persecution in the late first century throught the middle of the fourth century that Christians had very little time to consider holidays or feast days.

While it is true that no one knows the exact date of Christ's birth, that should not stop faithful Christians from celebrating His birth. If tradition sets the date on December 25 - so be it. If that date coincides with a pagan tradition - so what? As long as it is Christ that is being celebrated what difference does it make?

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ORIGINAL: campbe33

'Why Believe in a God? Just be Good' Ads Set to Run Next Week On D.C. Buses

Washington, D.C. — You better watch out. There is a new combatant in the Christmas wars.

Ads proclaiming, "Why believe in a god? Just be good for goodness' sake," will appear on Washington, D.C., buses starting next week and running through December. The American Humanist Association unveiled the provocative $40,000 holiday ad campaign Tuesday.

In lifting lyrics from "Santa Claus is Coming to Town," the Washington-based group is wading into what has become a perennial debate over commercialism, religion in the public square and the meaning of Christmas.

"We are trying to reach our audience, and sometimes in order to reach an audience, everybody has to hear you," said Fred Edwords, spokesman for the humanist group. "Our reason for doing it during the holidays is there are an awful lot of agnostics, atheists and other types of non-theists who feel a little alone during the holidays because of its association with traditional religion."

To that end, the ads and posters will include a link to a Web site that will seek to connect and organize like-minded thinkers in the D.C. area, Edwords said.

FULL STORY HERE

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ORIGINAL: campbe33

I think establishing it as a Holiday to promote goodwill among everyone, atheist included is a very good and intelligent idea. I do however, strongly disagree with them for promoting it as "Why believe in God". I do think it is an excellent opportunity for Christians to go door to door ringing bells and sharing the Gospel of the Lord. "I do believe does give us a Christians a reason to share the Season of God's Word."

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Matthew 2:11-15 (New Living Translation)
11 They entered the house and saw the child with his mother, Mary, and they bowed down and worshiped him. Then they opened their treasure chests and gave him gifts of gold, frankincense, and myrrh.

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ORIGINAL: jazzact13

So, do any of those Humanists tell us what they mean by "be good"?

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ORIGINAL: campbe33

'Why Believe in a God? Just be Good' Ads Set to Run Next Week On D.C. Buses

Washington, D.C. — You better watch out. There is a new combatant in the Christmas wars.

Ads proclaiming, "Why believe in a god? Just be good for goodness' sake," will appear on Washington, D.C., buses starting next week and running through December. The American Humanist Association unveiled the provocative $40,000 holiday ad campaign Tuesday.

In lifting lyrics from "Santa Claus is Coming to Town," the Washington-based group is wading into what has become a perennial debate over commercialism, religion in the public square and the meaning of Christmas.

"We are trying to reach our audience, and sometimes in order to reach an audience, everybody has to hear you," said Fred Edwords, spokesman for the humanist group. "Our reason for doing it during the holidays is there are an awful lot of agnostics, atheists and other types of non-theists who feel a little alone during the holidays because of its association with traditional religion."

To that end, the ads and posters will include a link to a Web site that will seek to connect and organize like-minded thinkers in the D.C. area, Edwords said.

FULL STORY HERE

Personally I stopped celebrating Christmas as Christ birthday 5 years ago, because it was a man-made holiday. I did this because Christmas started as something else. If you bring St. Nicolas into the equation, who was an actual "Saint". Saint Nicholas (Greek: ¢ãéïò Íéêüëáïò , Agios Nikolaos, "victory of the people") is the common name for Nicholas of Myra, a Christian saint and Bishop of Myra in Lycia of Anatolia (modern-day Antalya province, Turkey, though at the time it was a Greek-speaking Roman Province). Because of the many miracles attributed to his intercessions. It was also derived from the "Winter Soltice". Modern Christmas with pagan customs include: gift-giving and merrymaking from Roman Saturnalia; greenery, lights, and charity from the Roman New Year; and Yule logs and various foods from Teutonic feasts.[11] Pagan Scandinavia celebrated a winter festival called Yule, held in the late December to early January period. As Northern Europe was the last part to Christianize, its pagan traditions had a major influence on Christmas. Scandinavians still call Christmas Jul. In English, word Yule is synonymous with Christmas, a usage first recorded in 900. Once again Christians take a pagan holiday and make it a Christian one. Christ was not born at this time, so why do we celebrate it as though he was born on the 25th of December. I instead started celebrating just as a time of goodwill and giving. Though I might not support the reason behind this campaign, I do see this as just another man-made holiday. It has gotten way to commercialized with children just expecting to get their hearts desire. Don't get me wrong I realllllyyyy love Christ, but I just refuse to go on ignore the facts stated above. Therefore, I cannot go on celebrating his fake birthday. I still love all the Christmas Specials I grew up with. I just think it's time for Christians to face the truth about Christmas. I think establishing it as a Holiday to promote goodwill among everyone, atheist included is a very good and intelligent idea. I do however, strongly disagree with them for promoting it as "Why believe in God". I do think it is an excellent opportunity for Christians to go door to door ringing bells and sharing the Gospel of the Lord. "I do believe does give us a Christians a reason to share the Season of God's Word."

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We are trying to reach our audience, and sometimes in order to reach an audience, everybody has to hear you," said Fred Edwords, spokesman for the humanist group.

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Since the bus ad comes from the AHA, they would promote the ideals in the Humanist Manifesto:

"Ethical values are derived from human need and interest as tested by experience. Humanists ground values in human welfare shaped by human circumstances, interests, and concerns and extended to the global ecosystem and beyond. We are committed to treating each person as having inherent worth and dignity, and to making informed choices in a context of freedom consonant with responsibility."

More info if you click the link.

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ORIGINAL: Jhud

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Since the bus ad comes from the AHA, they would promote the ideals in the Humanist Manifesto:

"Ethical values are derived from human need and interest as tested by experience. Humanists ground values in human welfare shaped by human circumstances, interests, and concerns and extended to the global ecosystem and beyond. We are committed to treating each person as having inherent worth and dignity, and to making informed choices in a context of freedom consonant with responsibility."

More info if you click the link.

So basically their own made up idea of good.

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