RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education" TV Ad
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/10/2008 9:48:27 PM
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rcjames
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quote:
ORIGINAL: todd_t
But the legislation allowed local school boards to teach "age-appropriate" sex education, not comprehensive lessons to kindergartners, and it gave schools the ability to warn young children about inappropriate touching and sexual predators.
Par of what you say is true, part is not.
It did teach about bad touches, but also went a lot further with the 5 year olds. Again you just post the demokrat talking points.
You seem to be an intellegent person; do some research into the bill and its application and content. And please use someone besides the Daily Kos or MSNBC.
I just do not have the time right now.
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/10/2008 9:53:05 PM
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inthysite
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quote:
ORIGINAL: wing2000
as some one else already asked:
What is the "sex education" that was going to be taught?
Well see, that's the whole problem. They usually just call it "age appropriate" but never define what that is or who determines it. The language of these types of bills is so generic it opens the door to all possibilities, usually leaving the determination at the discretion of the school board.
What you or I consider appropriate for our children to learn, know or understand may not be and usually isn't what the school board considers appropriate. As has been illustrated with the King & King story.
_____________________________
Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart
Be acceptable in Thy sight, O LORD, my rock and my Redeemer - Psalm 19:14
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/10/2008 10:01:37 PM
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relady
Posts: 1281
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Not that too many out here will care to see the facts on this argument but here is the link to what Factcheck.org has to say. I think a few out here might still be looking for the truth rather than "slime". They have several direct quotes from sections of the legislation, which BTW, never made it past the committee stage. I believe it died before it hit the full Senate floor. Obama on Sex Ed
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/10/2008 10:08:02 PM
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deliveredarling
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I appreciated the link. I certainly feel better knowing that it was just a verbal attack on him and there isn't any truth to the slime. So thank you.
_____________________________
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Luke 8:16
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/10/2008 10:22:52 PM
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ljmac
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Never trust anyone who thinks anal intercourse between two men is the same as heterosexual intercourse. Their minds are already polluted.
Bill Clinton's surgeon general, the nutty Jocelyn Elders, accidentally told people she wanted to teach children to masturbate. A few years later her boss was involved in scandalous perversities that included obscene phone calls.
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/10/2008 10:24:09 PM
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inthysite
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Here is the link to the actual bill
AN ACT concerning education.
No where in this bill does it define what is "age appropriate" or who determines it.
All course material and instruction shall be age and developmentally appropriate.
...
and whenever such courses of instruction are provided in any of grades K 6 through 12, then such courses also shall include age appropriate instruction on the prevention of sexually transmitted infections, including the prevention, transmission and spread of HIV AIDS.
Please tell me what is the "age appropriate" way of telling a 5 year old about sexually transmitted disease?
quote:
They have several direct quotes from sections of the legislation, which BTW, never made it past the committee stage. I believe it died before it hit the full Senate floor.
It is a good thing that this bill died, however that's not the point. The point is that NObama supported this bill under the guise of protecting children from abuse. However this bill goes much farther than that and would have definitely had unintended consequences.
_____________________________
Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart
Be acceptable in Thy sight, O LORD, my rock and my Redeemer - Psalm 19:14
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/10/2008 10:24:17 PM
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relady
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I'm glad someone did. Factcheck.org is a great political fact checking site. You should bookmark it, it comes in handy during election cycles. 
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/10/2008 10:25:22 PM
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ManimalX
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
I appreciated the link. I certainly feel better knowing that it was just a verbal attack on him and there isn't any truth to the slime. So thank you.
It doesn't matter if it passed or not. It matters that Obama supported it.
_____________________________
"But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed." - 2nd Peter 3:10
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/10/2008 10:29:21 PM
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relady
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quote:
It doesn't matter if it passed or not. It matters that Obama supported it. Not to those of us who read far enough to know the legislation wasn't what it's being passed off as being. LIES from the right...I'm shocked....SHOCKED.. I tell you!
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/10/2008 10:40:40 PM
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inthysite
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quote:
ORIGINAL: relady
quote:
It doesn't matter if it passed or not. It matters that Obama supported it. Not to those of us who read far enough to know the legislation wasn't what it's being passed off as being. LIES from the right...I'm shocked....SHOCKED.. I tell you!
Again, I must disagree and I think factcheck got this one wrong. McCain's claim is ""legislation to teach 'comprehensive sex education' to kindergarteners."
The bill does just this. If you read the bill it does state this:
Each class or course in comprehensive sex education offered in any of grades K 6 through 12 shall include instruction on the prevention of sexually transmitted infections, including the prevention, transmission and spread of HIV AIDS.
Now they do add the caveat of "age appropriate", and this is the basis that factcheck says McCain is in error but as I have said and continue to say, no where do they define what this is.
I have seen too many times when legislation like this is passed, where vague and ambiguous terms are used, it opens the door to interpretation. Who will do the interpretation in this case? Initially either the teacher or the school board, until a savy parent catches on to what is going on and takes it to court.
_____________________________
Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart
Be acceptable in Thy sight, O LORD, my rock and my Redeemer - Psalm 19:14
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/10/2008 10:46:21 PM
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relady
Posts: 1281
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But the way it is presented is really misleading. The whole ad is misleading. And I don't know about you, but I'm just sick of that from both sides. it just seems like the right generally throws the first punch and this is a staple of how they run campaigns. And it's one of the main reasons I just can't get on board the Repub train.
Obama has stated plainly that he is not in favor of EXPLICIT sex ed for Kindergartners.
In any case, generally speaking I am in favor of comprehensive sex ed - including abstinence but not limited to abstinence. That is why I'm voting for Obama and you probably like the old guy or someone else.
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/10/2008 10:47:06 PM
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ljmac
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B.O. speaking to a murderous group of barbarians from the abortion company, Planned Parenthood:
“Now keep in mind that we’ve been in this fight, Pam and I, back in Illinois when I was the chairman of the Health Care Committee, helped to push through legislation. And I remember Alan Keyes...I remember him using this in a, his campaign against me saying, [mimicking Alan Keyes] “Barack Obama supports teaching sex education to kindergartners.” [Laughter] And, which I didn’t know what to tell him. But it’s the right thing to do, you know, to provide age-appropriate sex education, science-based sex education in the schools.”
Hire a liberal and pollute their minds.
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/10/2008 10:52:27 PM
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relady
Posts: 1281
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quote:
murderous group of barbarians from the abortion company Ah, yes, nothing quite like inflamatory name calling to encourage open debate. NOT. 
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/10/2008 10:56:11 PM
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ljmac
Posts: 1419
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quote:
ORIGINAL: relady
quote:
murderous group of barbarians from the abortion company Ah, yes, nothing quite like inflamatory name calling to encourage open debate. NOT.
Fifty million dead since Death Roe and they still aren't satisfied.
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/11/2008 7:03:25 AM
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deliveredarling
Posts: 1935
Joined: 8/30/2007
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quote:
All course material and instruction shall be age and developmentally appropriate.
...
and whenever such courses of instruction are provided in any of grades K 6 through 12, then such courses also shall include age appropriate instruction on the prevention of sexually transmitted infections, including the prevention, transmission and spread of HIV AIDS.
I'm still failing to see how this can be translated to indoctrination.
I see how it can be done age appropriately though.
As far as HIV/Aids, how about teaching the kids that if they find needles to not touch them and leave them alone. Many kids everyday watch their parents shoot up. To not tech this is irresponsible. We live in a depraved society.
STD's, how about teaching the kids proper hygiene? Don't use another's towel, don't share lipstick, ect, and especially don't sit on a public toilet seat?
It's common sense that I'm sure the educators have formally researched. It's also very needed information.
Parents are disillusioned if they think it will never happen to their child.
We can teach them the best that we can and they still end up making mistakes, mistakes that we KNOW we taught them better than to do. Any and all information may help.
_____________________________
"Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed: but he puts it on a lampstand, in order that those who come in may see the light."
Luke 8:16
http://www.myspace.com/egaip
Come visit
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/11/2008 8:47:49 AM
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P31W
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quote:
Each class or course in comprehensive sex education offered in any of grades K 6 through 12 shall include instruction on the prevention of sexually transmitted infections, including the prevention, transmission and spread of HIV AIDS.
Thanks you for the quote from the actual bill itself. This is correct. Because Public Schools must not be able to discriminate against one's sexual preferrance it's very possible that a homosexual man would be teaching this class or a woman who has had 2 abortions in the past and sees nothing wrong with it.
My "boss" when I was a sex ed teacher (by the way I was a hired social worker doing the teaching) was herself a lesbian. She was the main instructor most of the time. I would fill in for her when she was sick or had too many schools in our multi-country district to speak at.
quote:
I'm still failing to see how this can be translated to indoctrination.
You will get it one day. When your grandchild's lesbian Kindergarden teacher reads to the class my two dads. Your faith based community can yell at it wants but the "law" will prevent the school system from doing anything about it other than "promote" the school play where your child may be asked to play "mommie" with another girls who is also "mommie". Or your grandchildren go to the public library for the summer reading program and a book is being read to the group about tolerance for others who have "two loving dads" and that it's normal.
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/11/2008 8:58:56 AM
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P31W
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quote:
And in some instances the School Board doesn't want the parents to know what the curriculum will be; just try and get that information, including the teacher prep work and watch the fireworks start
Good point Rhippie!
Let me explain to you how I was hired and parents had NO CLUE that I even existed and I didn't answer to them about what "I" was teaching nor to the local school board.
The Miss. Board of Education in cooperation with the Miss. Dept of Health put funds together to form a team of us "sex educators" who worked with the local schools in our districts across the state. We also worked with teen pregnancy centers. "I" have taken more teenagers to "get the pill" from the Health Dept. than I can even remember.
The local teacher or principal in the school would contact us to come speak before their class, or classes. We were NEVER asked to have a guide line presented first and we were never told what to talk about. There was never a "limit" put on what we were to say by the school itself. Our real boss was the local health dept and they are almost like PPL when it comes to what "they" told us to teach and offer to the students.
One thing we always did was allow a bucket to be passed around the room. The kids would write out ANY QUESTION they had and we were to answer it to the best of our ability presenting "all" options or sides without bias.
(ROFL....do you have any idea how many teenage boys would ask some wild questions just to see how I would answer them.....)
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/11/2008 9:00:20 AM
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rcjames
Posts: 5600
Joined: 7/15/2005
From: Oklahoma
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quote:
ORIGINAL: wing2000
as some one else already asked:
What is the "sex education" that was going to be taught?
That seems to be the sixty four thousand dollar question.
The best I can come up with is "Age appropriate", or the spin from the Obama machine that it was to protect the children from predators.
Since "Age appropriate" is such a subjective term; I don't have a clue.
I do wish someone could find some specifics about what is taught to the 5 year olds without it being filtered through either one of the campaings.
It seems that what is really taught is some deep dark secret right up there with the aleins at Area 51. If it is only about "Bad touches" then why is there not some info on it.
There has to be a curriculum somewhere right? Or maybe not.
Thasnk
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/11/2008 9:03:53 AM
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P31W
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quote:
There has to be a curriculum somewhere right? Or maybe not.
There is tons of stuff out there for teaching all age groups. Some would have us say "ok" and others would have you runnning for the hills.
Each school board from what i understand would have selected it's own material. So I don't believe there is any "one curriculum" that anyone could point to and say "this is it".
That's why Obama was wrong to be part of this bill. He gave local school board a blank check to decide what "our" children were going to be learning.
quote:
Each class or course in comprehensive sex education offered in any of grades K 6 through 12 shall include instruction on the prevention of sexually transmitted infections, including the prevention, transmission and spread of HIV AIDS.
Look at this again from the bill. It gave the local school board a huge brush to paint with. Some liberal school boards would have a hay day with it.
Notice it says "each class or course" SHALL INCLUDE.....
That means if you teach K-3 you MUST INCLUDE STD's information.
I can tell you from experience that it's going to be hard to teach about STD's if someone does not FIRST teach about sexual intercourse!!!!!
< Message edited by P31W -- 9/11/2008 9:10:07 AM >
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/11/2008 12:14:42 PM
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inthysite
Posts: 770
Joined: 2/12/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
quote:
All course material and instruction shall be age and developmentally appropriate.
...
and whenever such courses of instruction are provided in any of grades K 6 through 12, then such courses also shall include age appropriate instruction on the prevention of sexually transmitted infections, including the prevention, transmission and spread of HIV AIDS.
I'm still failing to see how this can be translated to indoctrination.
I see how it can be done age appropriately though.
As far as HIV/Aids, how about teaching the kids that if they find needles to not touch them and leave them alone. Many kids everyday watch their parents shoot up. To not tech this is irresponsible. We live in a depraved society.
STD's, how about teaching the kids proper hygiene? Don't use another's towel, don't share lipstick, ect, and especially don't sit on a public toilet seat?
It's common sense that I'm sure the educators have formally researched. It's also very needed information.
Parents are disillusioned if they think it will never happen to their child.
We can teach them the best that we can and they still end up making mistakes, mistakes that we KNOW we taught them better than to do. Any and all information may help.
Because the bill addresses sex education and how to prevent sexually transmitted diseases, not hygiene, not drug prevention, not drug safety.
I'm trying to locate a link on the document that gives the curriculum that would have been approved for 5 year old, Level One Sex Education.
From what I've been told it includes the naming of body parts both male and female, it does cover affection between same sex couples and even covers discussions on masturbation. This is what is considered age appropriate for 5 year old boys and girls.
When I can find a link to this I will post it.
_____________________________
Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart
Be acceptable in Thy sight, O LORD, my rock and my Redeemer - Psalm 19:14
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RE: The Slime Is Getting Thick - McCain "Education... - 9/11/2008 12:17:17 PM
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SwedishCovenant
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quote:
ORIGINAL: ljmac
Bill Clinton's surgeon general, the nutty Jocelyn Elders, accidentally told people she wanted to teach children to masturbate. A few years later her boss was involved in scandalous perversities that included obscene phone calls.
As might have been expected, that assertion is, at a strained best, only fractionally true.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joycelyn_Elders
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