|
Users viewing this topic:
none
|
|
Login  | |
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/3/2008 5:53:41 PM
|
|
|
JimboFletch
Posts: 6613
Joined: 4/11/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
Making a statement such as "Thus saith the Lord, such and such will happen _________________on ___________" is akin to saying one is a Prophet.
Woluld you think that if a person says that they believe God told them this or that; that they are claiming the office of Prophet.
If you do please explain.
I am not a prophet, but i have thought that God had spoke to me about things that did not happen; does that make my a false Prophet, or just on over zealous Believer.
I still have never heard Robertson claim the office of Prophet.
I will say that I find myself in a stramge position of seemingly defending someone of whom I am not especially fond of.
Thanks
RC
I understand the strange feeling - and I agree with you. If Pat had retired 10-12 years ago and stayed out of the limelight, he might be remembered with greater respect. The Pat I knew from the 70s was not the sad shell I see today.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/3/2008 6:08:48 PM
|
|
|
Thessa
Posts: 811
Status: offline
|
I dont think theres anything wrong at all in trying to figure out if some people are TRUE Christians or not. Because some profess to be that arent. In the last days we as Christians will have to figure out who is real and whos not. Having an opinion on the actions and comments of someone in society or otherwise can only be a good thing, so we are not to be falsely led.
_____________________________
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
John 3:16
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/3/2008 6:33:39 PM
|
|
|
earthless
Posts: 6254
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: where pigeons are wearing sweaters....
Status: online
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
Woluld you think that if a person says that they believe God told them this or that; that they are claiming the office of Prophet.
If you do please explain.
I am not a prophet, but i have thought that God had spoke to me about things that did not happen; does that make my a false Prophet, or just on over zealous Believer.
There is a grand difference between a believer feeling God spoke to him via Scripture, someone else, a situation, etc, etc...
And someone standing and stating, "God speaks and says... I will come down on NYC in two weeks and destroy their fancy condos and Infiniti G35's!!!!! I, the Lord of Hosts, speaks this now!!"
quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
I still have never heard Robertson claim the office of Prophet.
I will say that I find myself in a stramge position of seemingly defending someone of whom I am not especially fond of.
Thanks
RC
A quick example of this is when Pat Robertson announced to his television audience that there will be a major terrorist attack on the U.S. sometime late in 2007. Major cities and possibly millions of people will be affected. The attack may be nuclear.
How does he know? Has he been in touch with the Al Qaeda high command? No, God told him so. (God apparently did not use the word "nuclear" - that part is Robertson's guess.)
Then, God - or is it Robertson? - started hedging his bets: "the evil people will come after this country, and there's a possibility - not a possibility, a definite certainty - that chaos is going to rule.... God said he's going to restrain the evil, but he isn't necessarily going to restrain it in the beginning.... A lot of these things can be reversed; we just need to do a lot of praying."
Wrong. Nothing of the sort happened (thankfully).
Ho, hum.. just one of several examples.
_____________________________
Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/3/2008 9:15:31 PM
|
|
|
lw9
Posts: 1126
Joined: 7/22/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
rcjames: I still have never heard Robertson claim the office of Prophet.
People don't have to slap the label of prophet on themselves to be false prophets. If anyone claims to be hearing directly from God and is speaking for Him ["God told me...", "God gave me a word..."], then they are indeed putting themselves in the shoes of a prophet and those words had better be correct. Pat Robertson has claimed to be hearing from God and has falsely prophecied too many times to count. Here's just one example:
quote:
Transcript from 700 Club broadcast, 1/2/2007:
"I’ve put these things out with humility but nevertheless I have a relatively good track record. Sometimes I miss.
The first thing, Terry, I think is God’s word to his people, to the believers worldwide not just here in America, and the promise is that this year is going to be a year of extraordinary miracles. And if I’m hearing the Lord right there’s such extraordinary things are going to take place. Victory over demonic powers, victory of healing, some dramatic miracles taking place in people’s lives and the Lord said it’s going to seem to the people like heaven has come down to earth. It’s going to be that good, it’s going to be really an extraordinary demonstration of God’s power.
Well, the other thing I felt was that evil men, evil people are going to try to do evil things to us and to others during the last part of this year. I don’t know whether it will be in the fall or September or later on but it will be in the second half somehow of 2007. There will be some very serious terrorist attacks. The evil people will come after this country and there’s a possibility that – not a possibility – a definite certainty that chaos is going to rule and the Lord says the politicians will not have any solutions for it. It’s just going to be chaos.
It’s going to happen. And I’m not saying necessarily nuclear. The Lord didn’t say nuclear, but I do believe it will be something like that, that’ll be mass killing, possibly millions of people, major cities injured. I hope I’m wrong, I hope people will pray and that won’t happen but nevertheless that seems to be what’s coming up and then the Lord said He will restrain the evil people but He will not restrain them necessarily initially and He doesn’t have to restrain people, you know, they’re evil people and they do evil things and they desire evil.
The other thing on my heart and on His heart is the nation of Israel. What He says was the US pretends to be the supporter of Israel and we are pushing Israel toward national suicide. Our policies are pushing Israel toward national suicide and He also said that the policies of current Israeli administration are quote toxic for the nation of Israel so the last couple of years He has that this is, we are entering into the most dangerous time in the history of Israel. War sooner or later is coming.
We should expect miracles beyond our wildest fantasies in the first 6 months and then after that chaotic."
Edit to add: Just noticed that earthless posted the same example. I'll leave it since it's a more complete transcript.
Bottom line: False prophet.
_____________________________
Aperture Science. We do what we must because we can.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/3/2008 9:27:34 PM
|
|
|
iluvatar
Posts: 1968
Joined: 4/12/2005
Status: online
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: colliefan
The guy is a snake oil salesman. He used his ministries flying hospital to fly equipment to his diamond mines in Africa. He claims that his herbal medicines enable him to leg press a half-ton. His "word of knowledge" about a certain condition are on the same level as Miss June seeing Bobby on Romper Room. The question is if he is a Christian snake oil salesman. His continual statements such as "God told me that...." make me think not.
Let's not forget his defense of Charles Taylor, former president of Liberia and accused war criminal as a "Christian, Baptist president" fighting against "Muslim rebels." That pretty much solidified by attitude towards Robertson.
-Dan.
_____________________________
Well, I've been to one world fair, a picnic, and a rodeo, and that's the stupidest thing I ever heard come over a set of earphones.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/4/2008 12:59:55 AM
|
|
|
Stephanos
Posts: 1100
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Midwestern Baptist Theological Seminary in KC MO
Status: offline
|
When I believe God has spoken to me, first off, i rarely tell others about it. I dont do this because God did not tell me to go out and tell this. Secondly, when I DO tell people what was laid on my heart, I make it very clear that while I do believe it WAS God, that I acknowledge that I could be wrong. I make it very clear that this is more "I believe this is what God told me" not "God told me!"
Earthless is right, any time someone makes the statement "God told me" or "God revealed to me" with no hint that they could be mistaken, the ARE placing themselves in the position and office of a prophet. Thus if they are wrong, even once, that makes them a false prophet, and should be at ignored, or if needed rebuked.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/4/2008 9:12:44 AM
|
|
|
rcjames
Posts: 5677
Joined: 7/15/2005
From: Oklahoma
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
I understand the strange feeling - and I agree with you. If Pat had retired 10-12 years ago and stayed out of the limelight, he might be remembered with greater respect. The Pat I knew from the 70s was not the sad shell I see today.
So true.
And I have seen the same thing with other ministers also; which is why I will not resist retiring to writing my memoirs instead of making an idiot of myself.
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/4/2008 9:17:06 AM
|
|
|
JimboFletch
Posts: 6613
Joined: 4/11/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Thessa
I dont think theres anything wrong at all in trying to figure out if some people are TRUE Christians or not. Because some profess to be that arent. In the last days we as Christians will have to figure out who is real and whos not. Having an opinion on the actions and comments of someone in society or otherwise can only be a good thing, so we are not to be falsely led.
The Lord seemed to be saying something different in Matthew 13:24-30.
Jesus presented another parable to them, saying, "The kingdom of heaven may be compared to a man who sowed good seed in his field.
"But while his men were sleeping, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went away.
"But when the wheat sprouted and bore grain, then the tares became evident also.
"The slaves of the landowner came and said to him, 'Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have tares?'
"And he said to them, 'An enemy has done this!' The slaves said to him, 'Do you want us, then, to go and gather them up?'
"But he said, 'No; for while you are gathering up the tares, you may uproot the wheat with them.
'Allow both to grow together until the harvest; and in the time of the harvest I will say to the reapers, "First gather up the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them up; but gather the wheat into my barn."'"
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/4/2008 5:42:46 PM
|
|
|
JesKlu
Posts: 551
Joined: 4/16/2007
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: solomonsprayer
I have heard a lot of criticisms of Robertson's claims of divine justice for victims of natural disasters (for their sins) and other odd prophetic statements. Are these just anomolies or do they speak to something wrong with his Christian faith and chracter?
I've seen him show a lot of warmth and compassion on the 700Club show, but also heard of those controversial prophetic/judgmental type statements as well.
Hello Solomonsprayer,
I don't believe we can judge if he is saved or not. Only God knows the heart. But, like lw9 and earthless have pointed out, he has made these weird and wacked out statements that should be questioned. I don't believe we are to take him seriously, since he has claimed to prophecy but the prophecies didn't come true; we all know there is only one definition for that.
Edit: You know, I was just talking to Peter about this, and he said from from what Pat Robertson said (the quote lw9 gave) it sounds like fortune telling.
There is a little more to the story. My mother-in-law was one of Pat Robertson's prayer worriers in the early 1980's. She would ask for many prayers, for years, about Peter, and he prayed then in Jesus' name.
Peter's mom also was a prayer warrior with Jerry Rose who used to also work for CBN. But Peter's mom does not gather with these Christian men anymore, she is now in the LCMS.
Your sister in Christ Jesus,
Jessica
< Message edited by JesKlu -- 9/5/2008 11:00:19 AM >
_____________________________
And calling to him a child, he put him in the midst of them and said, "Truly, I say to you, unless you turn and become like children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/5/2008 6:52:07 PM
|
|
|
Thessa
Posts: 811
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
quote:
ORIGINAL: Thessa
I dont think theres anything wrong at all in trying to figure out if some people are TRUE Christians or not. Because some profess to be that arent. In the last days we as Christians will have to figure out who is real and whos not. Having an opinion on the actions and comments of someone in society or otherwise can only be a good thing, so we are not to be falsely led.
The Lord seemed to be saying something different in Matthew 13:24-30.
Jesus presented another parable to them, saying, "The kingdom of heaven may be compared to a man who sowed good seed in his field.
"But while his men were sleeping, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went away.
"But when the wheat sprouted and bore grain, then the tares became evident also.
"The slaves of the landowner came and said to him, 'Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have tares?'
"And he said to them, 'An enemy has done this!' The slaves said to him, 'Do you want us, then, to go and gather them up?'
"But he said, 'No; for while you are gathering up the tares, you may uproot the wheat with them.
'Allow both to grow together until the harvest; and in the time of the harvest I will say to the reapers, "First gather up the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them up; but gather the wheat into my barn."'"
That dosent proove what i said was wrong. Its a totally seperate issue.
http://www.gotquestions.org/tolerance-Christian.html
^^^
_____________________________
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
John 3:16
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/8/2008 9:52:48 AM
|
|
|
DaveW
Posts: 4110
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: MD suburbs of Washington DC
Status: offline
|
I believe that God can and does speak to current issues.
IF (I do not know if he does or does not) Robertson has a prophetic gift, it is untrained. That makes him undiciplined in what he proclaims and dangerous.
He needs a lot of study in HOW God proclaims disasters. It is never vague. It is specific and for particular offenses, and time is always given to repent. Look at Jonah. "Yet 30 days and Nineveh will be destroyed." They repented and it did not happen. Jeremiah gave specifics of seige before hand and they did not repent resulting in it happening just as he proclaimed.
There will come a time when that degree of prophetic unction will again be in effect. Perhaps not until the tribulation. But it will take trained and accountable people to carry it out. THe school of the prophets existed for a good reason: prophets need training in their gifting.
_____________________________
Avatar is Saphira 5 months and Louvena at 23 months!
We are now grandparents TWICE!!
====================================
Our CD is now available here:
http://cdbaby.com/cd/dswaggoner
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/8/2008 9:54:42 AM
|
|
|
earthless
Posts: 6254
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: where pigeons are wearing sweaters....
Status: online
|
Where did the Prophets of Scripture go for "training"? They were 100% correct if they were God's Prophets, or not if they were simply on their own volition or speaking for Satan.
Is this how some make excuses for the false prophets of our current age? Goodness...
_____________________________
Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/8/2008 9:56:20 AM
|
|
|
DaveW
Posts: 4110
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: MD suburbs of Washington DC
Status: offline
|
Scripture never tells us where they trained (except for Elisha). But we do see the school of prophets mentioned in several of the historical books of the OT. Elijah and Elisha both had dealiings wth that school.
_____________________________
Avatar is Saphira 5 months and Louvena at 23 months!
We are now grandparents TWICE!!
====================================
Our CD is now available here:
http://cdbaby.com/cd/dswaggoner
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/8/2008 10:04:36 AM
|
|
|
JimboFletch
Posts: 6613
Joined: 4/11/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Thessa
quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
quote:
ORIGINAL: Thessa
I dont think theres anything wrong at all in trying to figure out if some people are TRUE Christians or not. Because some profess to be that arent. In the last days we as Christians will have to figure out who is real and whos not. Having an opinion on the actions and comments of someone in society or otherwise can only be a good thing, so we are not to be falsely led.
The Lord seemed to be saying something different in Matthew 13:24-30.
Jesus presented another parable to them, saying, "The kingdom of heaven may be compared to a man who sowed good seed in his field.
"But while his men were sleeping, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went away.
"But when the wheat sprouted and bore grain, then the tares became evident also.
"The slaves of the landowner came and said to him, 'Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have tares?'
"And he said to them, 'An enemy has done this!' The slaves said to him, 'Do you want us, then, to go and gather them up?'
"But he said, 'No; for while you are gathering up the tares, you may uproot the wheat with them.
'Allow both to grow together until the harvest; and in the time of the harvest I will say to the reapers, "First gather up the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them up; but gather the wheat into my barn."'"
That dosent proove what i said was wrong. Its a totally seperate issue.
No, the Lord said it isn't your job to weed out the ones you think aren't saved, it is His alone because He alone knows.
BTW, it's spelled "separate." And "doesn't." And "prove."
^^^
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/8/2008 3:16:03 PM
|
|
|
Soxfan
Posts: 1492
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Connecticut
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: DaveW
IF (I do not know if he does or does not) Robertson has a prophetic gift, it is untrained. That makes him undiciplined in what he proclaims and dangerous.
Please show the exact Scripture(s) where it says that training was available for perfecting the gift of prophecy.
On the contrary, I do see Scripture stating that prophecy and prophets were to be 100% correct.
_____________________________
"This would be the first step in apostasy; men first forget the true, and then adore the false.".......C.H. Spurgeon
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/8/2008 10:10:40 PM
|
|
|
lw9
Posts: 1126
Joined: 7/22/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
DaveW: Scripture never tells us where they trained (except for Elisha). But we do see the school of prophets mentioned in several of the historical books of the OT. Elijah and Elisha both had dealiings wth that school.
'School' as in company or group - like school of fish. Not 'school' as in "Amaze your friends! Learn to prophecy in 6 easy lessons!". The translations I see call it 'company' rather than 'school'.
God speaks to the prophet, and the prophet repeats what is said. Pretty simple stuff - no training necessary. As noted by soxfan and earthless, prophets had to be 100% correct which totally rules out the notion of training to be prophets and possibly making mistakes along the way.
< Message edited by lw9 -- 9/8/2008 10:34:13 PM >
_____________________________
Aperture Science. We do what we must because we can.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/9/2008 6:12:33 AM
|
|
|
Thessa
Posts: 811
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
quote:
ORIGINAL: Thessa
quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
quote:
ORIGINAL: Thessa
I dont think theres anything wrong at all in trying to figure out if some people are TRUE Christians or not. Because some profess to be that arent. In the last days we as Christians will have to figure out who is real and whos not. Having an opinion on the actions and comments of someone in society or otherwise can only be a good thing, so we are not to be falsely led.
The Lord seemed to be saying something different in Matthew 13:24-30.
Jesus presented another parable to them, saying, "The kingdom of heaven may be compared to a man who sowed good seed in his field.
"But while his men were sleeping, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went away.
"But when the wheat sprouted and bore grain, then the tares became evident also.
"The slaves of the landowner came and said to him, 'Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have tares?'
"And he said to them, 'An enemy has done this!' The slaves said to him, 'Do you want us, then, to go and gather them up?'
"But he said, 'No; for while you are gathering up the tares, you may uproot the wheat with them.
'Allow both to grow together until the harvest; and in the time of the harvest I will say to the reapers, "First gather up the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them up; but gather the wheat into my barn."'"
That dosent proove what i said was wrong. Its a totally seperate issue.
No, the Lord said it isn't your job to weed out the ones you think aren't saved, it is His alone because He alone knows.
BTW, it's spelled "separate." And "doesn't." And "prove."
^^^
Stop being sarcastic. I can spell just fine thank you. 
Its not up to you to give me a lesson on grammar.
And yes its our job as Christians to state the truth. And to know when a person is falsely leading people with their message of faith, or not so much.
But while we are on the subject - give me some verses from the bible that support what you are saying. Because the ones you used before didnt do the trick.
< Message edited by Thessa -- 9/9/2008 6:21:56 AM >
_____________________________
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
John 3:16
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/9/2008 6:29:56 AM
|
|
|
DaveW
Posts: 4110
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: MD suburbs of Washington DC
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: lw9
'School' as in company or group - like school of fish. Not 'school' as in "Amaze your friends! Learn to prophecy in 6 easy lessons!". The translations I see call it 'company' rather than 'school'. The hebrew literally can be translated "a part of the sons of the prophets." "Sons" is in a wide sense and includes those being trained. So "school of the prophets" in the learning sense is a legitimate translation.
If you really understood what discipleship meant in Judaic culture, you would not make such a flippant comment as "...6 easy lessons."
_____________________________
Avatar is Saphira 5 months and Louvena at 23 months!
We are now grandparents TWICE!!
====================================
Our CD is now available here:
http://cdbaby.com/cd/dswaggoner
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/9/2008 8:32:06 AM
|
|
|
earthless
Posts: 6254
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: where pigeons are wearing sweaters....
Status: online
|
Dave,
This needs to be highlighted, not omitted from a quoted post:
"God speaks to the prophet, and the prophet repeats what is said. Pretty simple stuff - no training necessary. As noted by soxfan and earthless, prophets had to be 100% correct which totally rules out the notion of training to be prophets and possibly making mistakes along the way. "
God speaking LITERALLY out of the lips of a person does not require special prophet school training. That is why it is a supernatural gift.
_____________________________
Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/9/2008 2:24:51 PM
|
|
|
DaveW
Posts: 4110
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: MD suburbs of Washington DC
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
This needs to be highlighted, not omitted from a quoted post:
"God speaks to the prophet, and the prophet repeats what is said. Pretty simple stuff - no training necessary. As noted by soxfan and earthless, prophets had to be 100% correct which totally rules out the notion of training to be prophets and possibly making mistakes along the way. "
God speaking LITERALLY out of the lips of a person does not require special prophet school training. That is why it is a supernatural gift. And where do they learn how to respond properly to that gift?
You have been around pentecostal circles. You have heard tounges and intrepretation and prophecies at meetings, and you have probably heard the difference when someone yields to the HS and when someone speaks on their own initiantive, and that often the person speaking cannot tell the difference.
That needs to be trained. I was just reading 1 Cor 14 this morning on the train where Paul says that all were able to prophesy one by one and that others were to judge the utterances.
That is the NT model.
Robertson has no one to judge his statements.
1Co 14:29 Let two or three prophets speak, and let the others pass judgment.
1Co 14:30 But if a revelation is made to another who is seated, the first one must keep silent.
1Co 14:31 For you can all prophesy one by one, so that all may learn and all may be exhorted;
1Co 14:32 and the spirits of prophets are subject to prophets;
1Co 14:33 for God is not a God of confusion but of peace, as in all the churches of the saints.
_____________________________
Avatar is Saphira 5 months and Louvena at 23 months!
We are now grandparents TWICE!!
====================================
Our CD is now available here:
http://cdbaby.com/cd/dswaggoner
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/9/2008 4:05:04 PM
|
|
|
earthless
Posts: 6254
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: where pigeons are wearing sweaters....
Status: online
|
Dave,
So anyone claiming to speak Prophecy (literally - their lips are moving because God is doing so) if they are doing so with no other "Prophets" around them... no one can judge (test) the prophecy nor the speaker?
If the purpose of a prophet was to reveal truth from God, why would we need prophets if we have the completed revelation from God in the Bible?
If prophets were the “foundation” of the early church, are we still building the “foundation” today?
Can God give someone a message to deliver to someone else? Absolutely! Does God reveal truth to someone in a supernatural way and enable that person to deliver that message to others? Absolutely! But is this the biblical gift of prophecy? No.
Whatever the case, whenever a person claims to be speaking for God (the essence of prophecy) the key is to compare what is said with what the Bible says. If God were to speak through a person today, it would be in 100% complete agreement with what God has already said in the Bible.
God does not contradict Himself. 1 John 4:1 instructs us, “Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.”
1 Thessalonians 5:20-21 declares, “Do not treat prophecies with contempt. Test everything. Hold on to the good.”
So, whether is it a “word from the Lord” or a supposed prophecy, our response should be the same. Compare what is said to what the Word of God says. If it contradicts the Bible, throw it out. If it agrees with the Bible, pray for wisdom and discernment as to how to apply the message (2 Timothy 3:16-17; James 1:5).
_____________________________
Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Is Pat Robertson a Christian? - 9/10/2008 7:45:50 AM
|
|
|
DaveW
Posts: 4110
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: MD suburbs of Washington DC
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
Dave,
So anyone claiming to speak Prophecy (literally - their lips are moving because God is doing so) if they are doing so with no other "Prophets" around them... no one can judge (test) the prophecy nor the speaker?
God does not move the lips of the prophet. That would be how a demon operates. Prophets spoke as the Spirit inspired them to speak. If it were otherwise God would not have given in to Moses' claim of being "slow of speach" and sent Aaron. God would have taken direct control of Moses' mouth and be done with it.
quote:
If the purpose of a prophet was to reveal truth from God, why would we need prophets if we have the completed revelation from God in the Bible? Here is what Paul says:
1 Cor 14.24 But if all prophesy, and an unbeliever or outsider enters, he is convicted by all, he is called to account by all,
25 the secrets of his heart are disclosed, and so, falling on his face, he will worship God and declare that God is really among you.
What some person has been doing in private is NOT written in the bible, but according to this passage speaking it out is a legitimate function of the prophetic gift as used in the NT.
WHile you claim God can and does give messages, but that is not the "biblical gift of prophecy;" this passage IMO clearly contradicts that, saying it IS prophecy.
There is a difference between the OFFICE of a prophet and someone with a prophetic gift.
I do agree that WHAT EVER IS SAID must line up with scripture 100% to be a true word from the Lord. Absolutely.
< Message edited by DaveW -- 9/10/2008 7:55:18 AM >
_____________________________
Avatar is Saphira 5 months and Louvena at 23 months!
We are now grandparents TWICE!!
====================================
Our CD is now available here:
http://cdbaby.com/cd/dswaggoner
|
|
|
|
|
Forum Tools
Printable Version
