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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 8:55:44 AM
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deliveredarling
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quote:
When oil futures go up it DOES affect the price of gas but there will be a lag in the increase (or decrease) in the price you see at the pump.
I have a question.
This is what we see happen at the pump, the price of oil increases and the ppg (price per gallon) increase over night. The price of oil decreases and we see the ppg remain the same for weeks at a time.
Why is that?
The news reported that we wouldn't see the effects of the price per barrel for six months, yet when it increases, we see it immediately and the same oil is in the tanks at the gas station. The new oil hasn't even arrived and they have jacked up the ppg.
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 9:14:02 AM
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Sophie11
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
This is what we see happen at the pump, the price of oil increases and the ppg (price per gallon) increase over night. The price of oil decreases and we see the ppg remain the same for weeks at a time.
Why is that?
Ooooo, isn't that annoying! I have always wondered the same. I understand the whole futures thing but shouldn't it work both ways? If they predict it is going to be cheaper shouldn't it be that prices suddenly fall the way they suddenly rise?
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 9:37:36 AM
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Dubya
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quote:
ORIGINAL: mapachito13
quote:
ORIGINAL: Dubya
quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
quote:
I am sure the price of oil will spike on this news!
Wouldn't surprise me one bit! One little hint of an uproar and the speculators slap their greedy little hands together in anticipation.
News Flash!
Oil prices have been dropping sharply over the past few weeks.
Does this mean the so-called Dutch intelligence is somewhat lacking?
News flash!
When oil futures go up it DOES affect the price of gas but there will be a lag in the increase (or decrease) in the price you see at the pump.
And the reason why they are dropping is because Gustav didn't damage any platforms like they (the speculators) were betting on!
Every time Iran rattles a sabre, the price per barrel goes up $5-10!
Hey, I never said otherwise!
My point was that in REALITY oil prices have been on a steady downslide and is now below $110/barrel. You had made a point that the price of oil would spike on that news. IT HASN'T.
Now what do you say? Is the so-called Dutch intelligence bogus? or is there some other nefarious things going on behind the scenes?
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 9:41:46 AM
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deliveredarling
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quote:
Now what do you say? Is the so-called Dutch intelligence bogus? or is there some other nefarious things going on behind the scenes?
I believe that it isn't being given the coverage because it will interfere in party politics. That want us to focus on the candidates rather than real world issues.
_____________________________
"Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed: but he puts it on a lampstand, in order that those who come in may see the light."
Luke 8:16
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 9:47:11 AM
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Dubya
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
quote:
Now what do you say? Is the so-called Dutch intelligence bogus? or is there some other nefarious things going on behind the scenes?
I believe that it isn't being given the coverage because it will interfere in party politics. That want us to focus on the candidates rather than real world issues.
I'm sorry that the news hasn't hit the clueless public that doesn't even know how to invest in oil futures, but for the people who do invest it is very well known and followed very closely.
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 9:52:54 AM
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deliveredarling
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It's just another case of media suppression. Sad, but not unusual.
And America continues in it's peaceful dreams....
_____________________________
"Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed: but he puts it on a lampstand, in order that those who come in may see the light."
Luke 8:16
http://www.myspace.com/egaip
Come visit
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 10:00:31 AM
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Dubya
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
It's just another case of media suppression. Sad, but not unusual.
And America continues in it's peaceful dreams....
So back to my question...
If oil has NOT in fact increased in price but decreased and if the mere mention of bad news is supposed to increase oil price... what is the validity of the so-called Dutch intelligence?
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 10:22:49 AM
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Dubya
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The assertion was made that the news of an impending attack on Iran would spike oil prices.
I pointed out that oil prices have been on a steady downward slide for a few weeks including after this so-called intelligence report.
You seem to think that since all the other current events have pushed oil off the front pages that somehow prices haven't gone up yet.
I pointed out that the investors who actually move the market are always well informed of world events as well as financial news such as the current (minute by minute) price of oil.
So I am interested in why you suppose the price of oil is moving in the opposite direction of what you believe conventional wisdom would indicate.
I do not mean to play "word games" but when accusations are made about greed, etc and reality does not line up with the accusations, I'd like to know what the reasons might be.
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 10:39:59 AM
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deliveredarling
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First of all it was a discussion of whether or not we would attack Iran.
quote:
Will we attack Iran before the elections? Bush's final farewell?
I don't remember how the oil part was brought up.
The trend for the oil industry has been that any news of any kind, such as a high gust of wind circulating in the gulf, has increased the price per barrel.
In the last couple of months, all the talk of Iran caused the oil prices to spike dramatically.
Even when the talk died down, speculators then claimed the price had to remain high because, all of the sudden, as if out of the blue, cars appeared in China and India, therefore the the demand increased. Go figure, in 2008, these countries suddenly had more need for oil than ever before, as if they suddenly sprouted a population that was never before heard of.
My point being, the speculators will use anything to spike the price of oil. They are making a killing off of it.
I used to think it was Big Oil. You corrected that thinking. Then I started looking, listening, watching the speculators.
They are the reason it rises and fails.
Gustav had them on the edge of their seats, salivating over a price increase.
I just don't think that the media and government want to feed the fire of Iran right now due to the elections. I believe they favor McCain and news of an impending attack would hamper his agenda. Because we know he would be all over it!
_____________________________
"Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed: but he puts it on a lampstand, in order that those who come in may see the light."
Luke 8:16
http://www.myspace.com/egaip
Come visit
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 10:50:33 AM
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Dubya
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
First of all it was a discussion of whether or not we would attack Iran.
quote:
Will we attack Iran before the elections? Bush's final farewell?
I don't remember how the oil part was brought up.
The trend for the oil industry has been that any news of any kind, such as a high gust of wind circulating in the gulf, has increased the price per barrel.
In the last couple of months, all the talk of Iran caused the oil prices to spike dramatically.
Even when the talk died down, speculators then claimed the price had to remain high because, all of the sudden, as if out of the blue, cars appeared in China and India, therefore the the demand increased. Go figure, in 2008, these countries suddenly had more need for oil than ever before, as if they suddenly sprouted a population that was never before heard of.
My point being, the speculators will use anything to spike the price of oil. They are making a killing off of it.
I used to think it was Big Oil. You corrected that thinking. Then I started looking, listening, watching the speculators.
They are the reason it rises and fails.
Gustav had them on the edge of their seats, salivating over a price increase.
I just don't think that the media and government want to feed the fire of Iran right now due to the elections. I believe they favor McCain and news of an impending attack would hamper his agenda. Because we know he would be all over it!
It has been a while, actually, that Iran was considered as any cause for higher futures prices. The downward slide has been pretty steady for a few weeks now and it would not surprise me to see it drop below $100 per barrel in a couple of weeks.
Blaming speculators for the high price of oil is really overstated in my opinion. In the final analysis it is strictly supply and demand which regulates the world-wide price of crude oil. Speculation can certainly have a mrginal effect for a short period of time but if there is nothing backing up the speculation which substantially impact supply and demand thaen the price will drop to its natural equilibrium based on supply and demand. I really think that is what is happening now.
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 12:03:34 PM
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Dubya
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quote:
ORIGINAL: WesP
quote:
In the final analysis it is strictly supply and demand which regulates the world-wide price of crude oil. Speculation can certainly have a mrginal effect for a short period of time but if there is nothing backing up the speculation which substantially impact supply and demand thaen the price will drop to its natural equilibrium based on supply and demand. I really think that is what is happening now.
Then how do you account for the present price of gas? It is exhorbitantly higher than the increase in demand over the past 3 years, so it is not a short-term result. Gas is .30/gal cheaper now than it was when oil was $35/bbl higher. Oil went down 25% in price; gas went down less than 10%.
I'm not real sure on that because as a refined product gasoline prices are more complicated than crude oil prices. Refining capacity has an impact, transportation, etc. I know that much of the nation's refining capacity is temporarily reduced due to scheduled maintenance. It seems to me that gasoline prices will continue to fall over the next month or so as refining capacity comes back up.
I don't know the price of gasoline where you live but prices have come down close to 50 cents per gallon from the peak in the Houston area.
Remember also that the retail price can vary across the country due to differences in taxation, local blending requirements, and transportation.
Bottom line is that speculation has even less to do with gasoline prices than crude oil prices.
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 12:09:22 PM
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deliveredarling
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quote:
Bottom line is that speculation has even less to do with gasoline prices than crude oil prices.
I don't get that at all.
The ppg does vary dramatically based on the taxation. I saw that first hand while traveling this summer. There was a .60 cent difference between Texas and Mississippi. We were absolutely floored!
_____________________________
"Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed: but he puts it on a lampstand, in order that those who come in may see the light."
Luke 8:16
http://www.myspace.com/egaip
Come visit
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 2:56:13 PM
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mapachito13
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Read on marketwatch that the gas supply right now is high which is keeping the price of gas lower. This I am sure affects the amount of oil that refiners will order since they will turn down production to keep from making their gas inventories higher and deflating the price of gas more.
I guess supply and demand weighs on the oil companies more than Dutch spies! (Nice try Shell Oil!  )
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Peace Sells....But Who's Buying!
"I would argue that the most serious threat to the United States is not someone hiding in a cave in Pakistan or Afghanistan, but our own fiscal irresponsibility."-David Walker, fmr comptroller general of the US
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 3:06:59 PM
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deliveredarling
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Did anyone else hear that the price of a barrel should be at $65 and we should see that in the next six months?
_____________________________
"Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed: but he puts it on a lampstand, in order that those who come in may see the light."
Luke 8:16
http://www.myspace.com/egaip
Come visit
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 3:14:49 PM
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mapachito13
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
Did anyone else hear that the price of a barrel should be at $65 and we should see that in the next six months?
That should make gas go down to $2-2.50 a gallon in the real economic world. In the oil world though the price might actually go up for some unforeseen reason.
_____________________________
Peace Sells....But Who's Buying!
"I would argue that the most serious threat to the United States is not someone hiding in a cave in Pakistan or Afghanistan, but our own fiscal irresponsibility."-David Walker, fmr comptroller general of the US
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 4:49:57 PM
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colliefan
Posts: 2743
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Raleigh, NC
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quote:
My point being, the speculators will use anything to spike the price of oil. They are making a killing off of it.
Speculators are just part of the market and they are basing contracts on the way they believe the market will move. What have they done to cause the market price of corn to sky-rocket?
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 6:03:11 PM
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Dubya
Posts: 1033
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quote:
ORIGINAL: colliefan
quote:
My point being, the speculators will use anything to spike the price of oil. They are making a killing off of it.
Speculators are just part of the market and they are basing contracts on the way they believe the market will move. What have they done to cause the market price of corn to sky-rocket?
Exactly.
I am amazed by the rationale some people have adopted towards "speculators". Hey, if they are making such a killing, and it is so easy, why isn't everyone doing it? Kind of makes the critics look a little silly if they don't get in on it too, doesn't it?
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 8:54:12 PM
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deliveredarling
Posts: 1936
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I'm just curious then why both Obama and McCain are calling for investigations into the speculators, if they aren't responsible for the rising costs.
_____________________________
"Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed: but he puts it on a lampstand, in order that those who come in may see the light."
Luke 8:16
http://www.myspace.com/egaip
Come visit
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/4/2008 11:36:37 PM
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colliefan
Posts: 2743
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Raleigh, NC
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
I'm just curious then why both Obama and McCain are calling for investigations into the speculators, if they aren't responsible for the rising costs.
It plays in Peoria. Meaning the state of the curren educational system and the media has the mind-numbed masses with no understanding of the free market! They are simply playing to the vast ignorance of the American public!
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RE: Impending attack on Iran? - 9/5/2008 6:43:42 AM
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deliveredarling
Posts: 1936
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quote:
It plays in Peoria. Meaning the state of the curren educational system and the media has the mind-numbed masses with no understanding of the free market! They are simply playing to the vast ignorance of the American public!
So, IOW, it's grandstanding to get votes because the investigation would appeal to the seeming infraction upon the public?
_____________________________
"Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed: but he puts it on a lampstand, in order that those who come in may see the light."
Luke 8:16
http://www.myspace.com/egaip
Come visit
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