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RE: Bill Mahers New Anti-Religion Movie - 8/29/2008 10:24:23 AM
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solarflare
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Just another variation on:
"Has God really said?"
Honestly? What some people on these forums say concerning what they believe, disturbs me more than what Mr. Maher has to say. What else can we expect from unbelievers? It's the lack of knowledge of Biblical doctrine and the liberal interpretations of the Bible that I see so much, that have me concerned............
Although, Thessa, I do understand what you are saying.......but there are reasons that non-believers come to some of the conclusions that they do
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RE: Bill Mahers New Anti-Religion Movie - 8/29/2008 10:27:36 AM
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JimboFletch
Posts: 6628
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Bill Maher is a cynical, bitter reprobate with no power except that which people give him by paying him attention. I won't "boycott" the movie, I simply wouldn't watch it because I am no longer interested in anything the man says or does.
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RE: Bill Mahers New Anti-Religion Movie - 8/29/2008 10:29:00 AM
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AboundinginHisGrace
Posts: 403
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quote:
ORIGINAL: TorchHeart
Everyone has their opinions. Accepting that fact is the first step to being able to understand and then change them (if that is your goal).
We can't change anyone only God can. No matter how much we learn about what people believe, it will not help them come to reach God. Only the Holy Spirit can do that. It is our job to tell them about the good news of Christ, but I cannot convict anyone only the world of God and the Holy Spirit can do that. So for me to study up on what they believe and then try to argue with them until they become a Christian will not work. Only the people that God draws can come to know Him.
_____________________________
Ephesians 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.
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RE: Bill Mahers New Anti-Religion Movie - 8/29/2008 10:35:08 AM
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TorchHeart
Posts: 1497
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From: One of the coldest places on Earth
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quote:
It's the lack of knowledge of Biblical doctrine and the liberal interpretations of the Bible that I see so much, that have me concerned............
The entirely-literal and unbending interpretations of the Bible and Bible doctrine by many groups have me equally concerned (example: Creationism).
The Bible is open to interpretation, and not everyone is going to interpret it the same way, though there are points that (as Christians) we are all going to agree with, such as the granting of eternal salvation to us via Christ's sacrifice on the cross.
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RE: Bill Mahers New Anti-Religion Movie - 8/29/2008 10:45:01 AM
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AboundinginHisGrace
Posts: 403
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quote:
ORIGINAL: TorchHeart
quote:
It's the lack of knowledge of Biblical doctrine and the liberal interpretations of the Bible that I see so much, that have me concerned............
The entirely-literal and unbending interpretations of the Bible and Bible doctrine by many groups have me equally concerned (example: Creationism).
The Bible is open to interpretation, and not everyone is going to interpret it the same way, though there are points that (as Christians) we are all going to agree with, such as the granting of eternal salvation to us via Christ's sacrifice on the cross.
2 Peter 1:20 knowing this first, that no prophecy of Scripture is of any private interpretation
_____________________________
Ephesians 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.
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RE: Bill Mahers New Anti-Religion Movie - 8/29/2008 10:51:03 AM
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solarflare
Posts: 798
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quote:
ORIGINAL: TorchHeart
quote:
It's the lack of knowledge of Biblical doctrine and the liberal interpretations of the Bible that I see so much, that have me concerned............
The entirely-literal and unbending interpretations of the Bible and Bible doctrine by many groups have me equally concerned (example: Creationism).
The Bible is open to interpretation, and not everyone is going to interpret it the same way, though there are points that (as Christians) we are all going to agree with, such as the granting of eternal salvation to us via Christ's sacrifice on the cross.
"The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned. " I Cor. 2:14
Wisdom comes from the Spirit of God. " If any of you lacks wisdom, he should ask God, who gives generously to all without finding fault, and it will be given to him. But when he asks, he must believe and not doubt, because he who doubts is like a wave of the sea, blown and tossed by the wind. That man should not think he will receive anything from the Lord; he is a double-minded man, unstable in all he does." James 5-8
"Do not merely isten to the word, and so deceive yourselves. Do wht it says." James 1:22
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RE: Bill Mahers New Anti-Religion Movie - 8/29/2008 11:03:35 AM
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TorchHeart
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quote:
ORIGINAL: solarflare
quote:
ORIGINAL: TorchHeart
quote:
It's the lack of knowledge of Biblical doctrine and the liberal interpretations of the Bible that I see so much, that have me concerned............
The entirely-literal and unbending interpretations of the Bible and Bible doctrine by many groups have me equally concerned (example: Creationism).
The Bible is open to interpretation, and not everyone is going to interpret it the same way, though there are points that (as Christians) we are all going to agree with, such as the granting of eternal salvation to us via Christ's sacrifice on the cross.
"The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned. " I Cor. 2:14
Wisdom comes from the Spirit of God. " If any of you lacks wisdom, he should ask God, who gives generously to all without finding fault, and it will be given to him. But when he asks, he must believe and not doubt, because he who doubts is like a wave of the sea, blown and tossed by the wind. That man should not think he will receive anything from the Lord; he is a double-minded man, unstable in all he does." James 5-8
"Do not merely isten to the word, and so deceive yourselves. Do wht it says." James 1:22
That's exactly what I was saying. Thank you for summing it up so nicely with quotes from the Bible. It can be interpretted differently by everyone, but the Spirit of God will help us with those interpretations.
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RE: Bill Mahers New Anti-Religion Movie - 8/29/2008 12:34:44 PM
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TorchHeart
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quote:
ORIGINAL: AboundinginHisGrace
2 Peter 1:20 knowing this first, that no prophecy of Scripture is of any private interpretation
Exactly! There are countless interpretations of it. Some are going to be right; some are going to be wrong. That's why there is no private interpretation. We need to ask God how He wants us to interpret sections of the Bible so that we can get it right. His Spirit will guide us.
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RE: Bill Mahers New Anti-Religion Movie - 8/29/2008 1:50:20 PM
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AboundinginHisGrace
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quote:
ORIGINAL: TorchHeart
quote:
ORIGINAL: AboundinginHisGrace
2 Peter 1:20 knowing this first, that no prophecy of Scripture is of any private interpretation
Exactly! There are countless interpretations of it. Some are going to be right; some are going to be wrong. That's why there is no private interpretation. We need to ask God how He wants us to interpret sections of the Bible so that we can get it right. His Spirit will guide us.
There is always One Truth. God is not a God of confusion, so He will not guide me to interpret something different than someone else, someone has to be wrong.
_____________________________
Ephesians 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.
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RE: Bill Mahers New Anti-Religion Movie - 8/29/2008 2:02:52 PM
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TorchHeart
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Just because there is "one truth" doesn't mean that its going to be confusing, or that God is going to make one person's view of the Bible contradict another's. The fact is, though, that there are many ways to interpert the Bible. Historical, literal, allegorical, etc. All just as valid as the next. Now, some of them ARE going to be wrong. As you said, someone has to be. But that doesn't mean that only one is right.
This is why we have so many different branches (denominations) of Christianity. Roman Catholicism, Lutheran, Presbyterian, Eastern Othrodox Catholicisim, Evangelical, and Angelican just to name a few of them. So if these groups are all interperting the Bible differently, which one is right?
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RE: Bill Mahers New Anti-Religion Movie - 8/29/2008 2:12:10 PM
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Walker311
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There is only one way to interpret the bible and that is through faith.
For without faith we cannot please God and we cannot accept His word and His son. The various religions are not differing interpretations but rather man-made beliefs.
I interpret that Eve listened to a snake... a talking snake. I also interpret that Mary never slept with a man yet conceived the creator who is also our savior.
I cannot believe these things and Bill Maher cannot believe these things without faith.
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RE: Bill Mahers New Anti-Religion Movie - 8/29/2008 2:17:05 PM
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stellaluna
Posts: 4228
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1) Bill Maher has an overinflated opinion of himself. Luckily, I have an underinflated opinion of him, so it balances out. His movie will likely be poorly done.
2) I have known lots of "self-proclaimed" atheists. I would be say about 98% of them aren't true atheists. They are simply hurt and broken people who are taking anger out on God, and moreso, attempting to hurt the Christians in their lives that have been hypocritical in showing others the love of Christ. (Usually this is a relative.)
3) I doubt I'll see the movie, because I don't like Bill Maher and I really don't care. But this does remind me a little bit about "Jesus Camp." Remember that movie? Trust me, it did not make Christians look better in the public eye and I was a bit horrified by it myself. And the point of that is that Christians need to chill and quit acting like crazies. That drives a lot of people away.
(And a side bar, there are lots and lots of people who have no problem with God, but have huge problems with Jesus. Chew on that.)
_____________________________
Who should be allowed to attend church?
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RE: Bill Mahers New Anti-Religion Movie - 8/29/2008 2:19:55 PM
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TorchHeart
Posts: 1497
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I think you mean denominations, not religions. Or am I mistaken? At any rate, those man-made beliefs are based on differing interpretations, either way.
Example: I interpret adn believe that Mary never slept with a man, yet conceived the creator and our Savior.
I interpret that Eve listened to a snake, but not that this occurred only 5,000 years ago (the Earth is many million years old, and God has provided us with countless pieces of evidence to varify this). The story of Adam and Eve has more meaning behind it, and isn't meant to be taken as a historical fact.
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RE: Bill Mahers New Anti-Religion Movie - 8/29/2008 2:23:22 PM
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TorchHeart
Posts: 1497
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quote:
ORIGINAL: WesP
quote:
So if these groups are all interperting the Bible differently, which one is right?
None of them. Every denomination adds to what the bible says. If everyone approached the words of God without trying to add anything, then we would all be on the same page. If you don't know, don't state a belief. Wait until God leads you to understanding.
I can go with that.
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RE: Bill Mahers New Anti-Religion Movie - 8/29/2008 2:25:35 PM
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TorchHeart
Posts: 1497
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From: One of the coldest places on Earth
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quote:
ORIGINAL: WesP
quote:
the Earth is many million years old, and God has provided us with countless pieces of evidence to varify this
That is a supposition based upon a set of "facts" that you cannot corroborate, so you accept on faith. The key is to not force that perception on others or make it seem a mandate for belief. I believe many things not stated in the bible, but I do not go around saying, "This is the only truth!" These beliefs are also subject to change as I grow. They are not salvic beliefs, and I will not argue them because they are personal beliefs.
They are actually scientificly proven facts which (for the most part) can be cooroborated, but fair enough. They are as open to debate as anything else.
ADDED: But that's a little bit of what gets to me: Why is a debate like Creationism vs Evolution so important to Christians? What basis does this have on the bigger picture of our faith? Whether God created the world in six days or whether He decided to do it in 20,000,000,000 years (yes, I still believe that God was the creator of the world), is that going to affect the key points of Christianity? I think this is why Mahar and some other atheists look at us with bewilderment when we can get in such a fever over this argument.
< Message edited by TorchHeart -- 8/29/2008 2:31:56 PM >
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RE: Bill Mahers New Anti-Religion Movie - 8/29/2008 2:51:37 PM
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solarflare
Posts: 798
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I am not bothered by debates on the age of the earth or if someone believes the 'gap' theory. What does grate me, however, is the THEORY of evolution being called 'science' when it is really still a THEORY.
I have studied science enough to know that there is no way that evolution even begins to qualify as a science, let alone a believable one. Even so, I do have problems with the 6 days being 24 hr cyles, but I'm not going to argue it. I certainly don't think my great (x 1000 yrs +) uncle was a monkey either.  Is that where that expression a monkey's uncle came from?
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RE: Bill Mahers New Anti-Religion Movie - 8/29/2008 2:59:55 PM
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AboundinginHisGrace
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There are just as many facts that prove the earth is not that old as well. If you carbon date a tupawear bowl it says its thousands of years old. Also under conditions such as the flood, also tampers with carbon dating bigtime. Also God created the earth aged/appearance of being aged. He created Adam full grown, He created the trees full grown, mountains, water etc. This can also give the appearance of things being older, erosion etc. Just think about the erosion the flood would have caused.... So you do not have the facts to prove the earth is that old, because I am sure you have no idea how to carbon date anything, you are just going off of the word of someone you do not know and some method that we do not even know is correct. I will stick with what the bible says.
_____________________________
Ephesians 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.
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RE: Bill Mahers New Anti-Religion Movie - 8/29/2008 3:20:44 PM
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terryjohn
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Only the mature should see this movie. It is not comedy but it is one every serious christian who loves the lost should see for it is full of questions that the lost are asking and dealing with. I personally would love to study this film and I am sure already it has inspired numerous christian scholars to write a biblical defense against the charges raised. I personally believe from what I have seen that many intellectuals will not be laughing and will be shocked that they never thought to ask such questions but more shocked to see the foolishness of this mans thinking as being touted as intellectualism. I also believe many more of them will sit back in fear that there is a God because of this guy. That is even as I was watching God gave me real answers to his accussations as I beleive He will do to all right thinking men and women who are interested in the truth.
Hence, I do find in the clip viewed that he does have some valid accusations against the religious as Christ Himself did. I think it was said in the old testament that all the world speaks evil of God because of them and now we find all the world speaks evil of God because of us.
Critics may come and go and they are God's audit of His people. Instead of beating them and ignoring them, we should listen least we be accused of not listening to the prophets as we accuse others of doing in the past.
Your threat to leave if you do not find people who agree with you is uncalled for. I actually want now to go out and talk to such people as bill as I beleive they need answers.
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