|
Users viewing this topic:
none
|
|
Login  | |
|
RE: How Could a Christian Support Obama? - 9/1/2008 3:43:31 PM
|
|
|
rcamejo01
Posts: 305
Joined: 8/27/2007
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: AdrianaS
quote:
ORIGINAL: AGGoldstein
If both parties have shares equaling sin against the Lord Most High
on what biblical principle then do most Christians on these forums support McCain and the GOP?
I have an oppinion:
1) I do think political party can become an idol. 2) Mr McCain may have deep simpathy from people because he is a veterean of war and was prisoner of war...he served his country as many did too. This nation is a nation of war with largest arsenal in the world. There are many veterans and people who are proud patriots for serving the country, of course. 3) Mr. McCain is a politician for a looong time and I think he is viewed as moderate Republican.
About bible principles and why people who read their bibles forget Mr McCain actual marriage was born in adultery, and many christians do believe in marriage covenants before the Lord. Why people choose to ignore that and why people choose to point out most the other candidate des-qualifications - I dont understand. If someone wants to take 10 Commandments to the heart and not just fight for it to be shown in public places, at least do take into consideration the standings of both candidates . Because to me is hypocresy, before the Lord Most High and the world observing their testimonies, as one party saying they are the ones carrying the banner of God, biblical principles etc etc when they too miss the mark.
Now, most Christians on these foruns may have their standings as a particular group of conservatives posting for a while here and even belong to specific denomination, country region and even skin color in their majority belongs to GOP, it seems GOP is the right wing (?) do have a known face of some sorts. But there are other groups of conservatives and moderates Christians that are maybe not here represented (as some are and more steady vocal) and have not an already "known face" but sure we will see their votes in their elections where their standings are. I am certain people who belongs and trust the Lord will pray and observe all and in the midst of propaganda going on both sides etc, finaly cast votes in November and than we will see the results in reality of facts!
[Thank you, my oppinion, as foreigner born, born again believer at 33 , who lives in US for almost 20 years. )
Nice post, you are right. Most people either forget or ignore that McCain's marriage was born out of adultery. But hey he's Pro-life I guess that makes it ok,LOL!
_____________________________
In your prayers, please remember my sister Liz, if you havent heard: http://caringbridge.org/visit/lizettecano
|
|
|
|
|
RE: How Could a Christian Support Obama? - 9/1/2008 4:07:53 PM
|
|
|
rgod
Posts: 1774
Joined: 4/25/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: TorchHeart
quote:
I really just want to know from people who claim to be christian and who believe fully in the Word of God. Those who have looked at the voting record of Obama and even the stands of the democratic party, how can you vote for Obama? Issue after issue how do you support what God opposes? I can see where people lose faith in christianity. One person told me in my last post on this forum that I would be left stranded on the road if I broke down for being overweight. That's nice to know.
Just don't get people claiming God but denying what the bible says about living it out. May be some person is going to shed some light.
Anybody who thinks likes this (with no offense to the OP), in my estimation, should take a look at this book:
http://www.amazon.com/Gods-Politics-Right-Wrong-Doesnt/dp/0060834471/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1220213162&sr=1-1
Its called "God's Politics: Why the Right Gets It Wrong, and the Left Doesn't Get It" by Jim Wallice, and its a very frank look at both the Republican and Democratic parties, and how they traditionally view religion and use it in their political agendas. Such as how one side has tried to use religion to polarize people, while the other side has basically just ignored religion altogether. I found it to be very well balanced as it critcizes and commends BOTH sides for their uses of God and religion. It also does a good job of showing how people who maybe don't believe the same thing as you(regarding such things as abortion, civil rights, the war in Iraq, poverty, capital punishment, etc.) can vote for someone you don't agree with, and still call themselves a Christian.
This is great - I saw this book in the bookstore and loved the title. For a long time, I felt like I was in the minority of people that felt that neither of the parties adequately address biblical views. I flipped through it - and found a passage where it talked about the younger generation embracing and rejecting both sides. It gave me hope. I've always thought there was something skewed about people who think that republicans (or democrats) are the only true christians. It is like people elevate politics above faith. To me, each side supports only half of the bible and violates the other half. This is because they weight issues differently - when all of these issues are important to God (poverty, unborn children, fairness, justice, good stewardship).
It is so clear that politicians play the christian card to manipulate the people. What is sad to me is when christians don't recognize that, but internally divide over these things instead of saying "I don't agree with you - but you are still my brother or sister in Christ." Instead, we let people feed us nonsense - like if you are a christian you shouldn't care about the environment or social issues. Or, if you are a christian you should support abortions - no matter what. Come again? Either/Or? What about caring about all three issues? I've seen people write on these boards that they hate liberal democrats - with pride. I've heard in other places people speak of conservative christians with derision. This type of hatred is sin no matter how you slice it. If we speak this way are we any different from the world? Because really - the world sees us as all the same. I've heard some republicans totally bash George Bush because of his faith. I've heard some democrats bash Obama because of his. Let anyone stand up and talk about Jesus and see how quickly people turn on them. The real division is between christian and non-christian. We are called to love one another and be unified - not turn and devour each other because we have a difference in the direction that we feel is best for the country. And beyond this, we are also called to love our neighbors (christian or not) - and not only our brothers and sisters.
Personally, I would love to see a bipartisan christian group that looks at the issues that we have in common and gives them equal weights. We can then put pressure on both parties to move the country towards those ideals, regardless of how they go about it. Is there a congressional christian caucus that is bipartisan? If not, there should be one.
< Message edited by rgod -- 9/1/2008 4:14:16 PM >
|
|
|
|
|
RE: How Could a Christian Support Obama? - 9/1/2008 4:14:45 PM
|
|
|
AGGoldstein
Posts: 12
Joined: 9/1/2008
Status: offline
|
I understand people make personal mistakes and Yahweh forgives of course should they repent, which I believe differs to an ongoing stance about aborting a child or allowing a child to starve to death.
I believe both parties have their share of innocent lives lost, be it abortion or a child who loses their life because of lack of proper care (health, hunger :yes right here in America) or even the children losing their lives from the war in Iraq. We all know now that some deception was involved here less you're naive.
Lets be careful not to append God and his Holy and infallible law to any political party.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Christians and Voting - 9/1/2008 4:20:47 PM
|
|
|
rgod
Posts: 1774
Joined: 4/25/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: tafkam
quote:
WE want some babies to come here so we don't have to feed them. They need to get up, pull theirselves up by the bootstraps and find a job in this good economy.
Okay, I take back what I said in an earlier thread.....THIS is the most asinine post I've seen on these forums (and that's saying something)
You heard it here folks! The GOP wants BABIES to go out and get jobs! Wow!
tafkam - I think that maybe this was sarcasm? Maybe the original poster might tell me if I'm on the right track. She seemed to be saying that conservatives want babies to be born, but after they are born, they don't want to to provide assistance is the family is poor. (Perhaps there are some people who might choose to have an abortion because they don't think that they can financially afford a child???).
|
|
|
|
|
RE: How Could a Christian Support Obama? - 9/1/2008 7:00:34 PM
|
|
|
tinydancer2
Posts: 1181
Joined: 3/21/2007
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: AGGoldstein
I understand people make personal mistakes and Yahweh forgives of course should they repent, which I believe differs to an ongoing stance about aborting a child or allowing a child to starve to death.
I believe both parties have their share of innocent lives lost, be it abortion or a child who loses their life because of lack of proper care (health, hunger :yes right here in America) or even the children losing their lives from the war in Iraq. We all know now that some deception was involved here less you're naive.
Lets be careful not to append God and his Holy and infallible law to any political party.
Amem as the Lord does forgive as people repent and turn from their ways.
But the way I see everything starts by personal sin and mistakes, everybody have their duties and responsabilities, the gov. have their own. Now when people for reason or another do not act responsable someone may have to "pay" for that. And comming from a country where abortion is illegal, where women go to jail for that (1 to 3 years) or do community service for 50 days ( a judge sent some of them to clean day care and schools, for them to reflect about maternity surrounded by children etc. Now, I do understand laws are laws, and abortion is illegal people are caught in clandestine clinics, or women when get to hospital after atempt herself do it doctors and nurses must call the police and etc. Still a million woman in my original country will abort "safely" because they are rich and have acess "quality" care; the poor ones will try themselves or have help of others ( by horse, pig, animal medicine and all kind of methods), some will die (70.000 a year dies) or be serious hurt (I think almost 300 thousand). Many will have their babies and abandon them as 8 million kids in Brasil are abandoned and 2 million on the streets. Themselves will start the cicle of getting pregnant at young age, no family support and many etc. Is a personal sin that becomes a social issue of great proportion. As How a nation where the abortion is illegal and heavy Roman Catholicism message to life, will be so terrible prepered to receive all the babies the try to save in utero? And punish women for killing babies the same government and pro-life advocates must come up with solution that save them in their young baby lifes but abandon them together with their mothers, to a life of dispair, crime, prostitution and etc
Then there are serious issues and abortion legal and illegal nations. And both are democracies. In OT bothe crimes as murder and adultery the sentence is death. Well, many people who are practicing both nowdays are not born again and others are born again believers. Plus, how a christian public servant are going to deal with the reality in their societies? How someone can comand the others to behave dont kill, still destroy is to call 911 law enforcement! But how can others impose others how to use their bodies and abstain and choose wise their parteners and not leave their responsabilities behind, stay with their families, support their babies and many many etc ?
Even those who know Scriptures and the Lord do behave just like the ones who do not know Him and still dead men walking, not born again! Then again how elected public servant is going to do when they supose to serve all? Is not walk in the park to serve all, at all! Particularly in a democracy and "We The People" are all the people in a nation from many walks of life and some from narrow and straight way and others from wide way and etc. Still the God we serve and belong is being paitiente for long time with ALL of us, if not He had already come and the rest would be earthly history we would even remember anymore, I supose, of course who want to remember here when we are in heaven with Him? No more tears, no more pain and dispair and so many things people suffer and need Him so bad, as we all need before coming to Him!
(Thanks, again, long writting again, sorry  . I am christian have heart for social issues veryyyyy much so, I cannot see just one side of issues and do empathize with many.)
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Christians and Voting - 9/2/2008 2:47:38 AM
|
|
|
SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5921
Joined: 4/15/2005
From: Northern Califonria
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: gaylel1
T.D. Jakes, the next Billy Graham by some, does support Obama--and he's the most famous televison preacher....
Famous and or popular doesn't equate to sound doctrine...
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 12:10 A righteous man regardeth the life of his beast: but the tender mercies of the wicked are cruel.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: How Could a Christian Support Obama? - 9/2/2008 2:50:23 AM
|
|
|
SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5921
Joined: 4/15/2005
From: Northern Califonria
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: AGGoldstein
I saw this thread and had to respond.
First if someone can answer a question for me not based on opinion but based on God's Word. What is the greater sin, abortion or a child dying of starvation?
If the parent murders the child with abortion or starvation it's still a grave sin...
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 12:10 A righteous man regardeth the life of his beast: but the tender mercies of the wicked are cruel.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: How Could a Christian Support Obama? - 9/2/2008 2:52:30 AM
|
|
|
SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5921
Joined: 4/15/2005
From: Northern Califonria
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: BlackCapnHarlock
quote:
ORIGINAL: AGGoldstein
I saw this thread and had to respond.
First if someone can answer a question for me not based on opinion but based on God's Word. What is the greater sin, abortion or a child dying of starvation?
Both are equal.
Just as endorsing homosexuality and lying to invade a nation and causing the deaths of thousands of innocent people.
Their is sin in the doctrine of both parties.
Ok... So how does the Christian avoid supporting evil with a vote for either? Is there some verse that suspends God's law on the first Tuesday of November?
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 12:10 A righteous man regardeth the life of his beast: but the tender mercies of the wicked are cruel.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Christians and Voting - 9/2/2008 2:54:47 AM
|
|
|
SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5921
Joined: 4/15/2005
From: Northern Califonria
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: rgod
quote:
ORIGINAL: tafkam
quote:
WE want some babies to come here so we don't have to feed them. They need to get up, pull theirselves up by the bootstraps and find a job in this good economy.
Okay, I take back what I said in an earlier thread.....THIS is the most asinine post I've seen on these forums (and that's saying something)
You heard it here folks! The GOP wants BABIES to go out and get jobs! Wow!
tafkam - I think that maybe this was sarcasm? Maybe the original poster might tell me if I'm on the right track. She seemed to be saying that conservatives want babies to be born, but after they are born, they don't want to to provide assistance is the family is poor. (Perhaps there are some people who might choose to have an abortion because they don't think that they can financially afford a child???).
To bad that wouldn't refrain from the act that creates children if they cannot financially afford a child.. Especially since that isn't hardly a valid reason to murder the child...
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 12:10 A righteous man regardeth the life of his beast: but the tender mercies of the wicked are cruel.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: How Could a Christian Support Obama? - 9/2/2008 3:19:14 AM
|
|
|
tracydolls
Posts: 1839
Joined: 3/30/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
This is great - I saw this book in the bookstore and loved the title. For a long time, I felt like I was in the minority of people that felt that neither of the parties adequately address biblical views. I flipped through it - and found a passage where it talked about the younger generation embracing and rejecting both sides. It gave me hope. I've always thought there was something skewed about people who think that republicans (or democrats) are the only true christians. It is like people elevate politics above faith. To me, each side supports only half of the bible and violates the other half. This is because they weight issues differently - when all of these issues are important to God (poverty, unborn children, fairness, justice, good stewardship).
It is so clear that politicians play the christian card to manipulate the people. What is sad to me is when christians don't recognize that, but internally divide over these things instead of saying "I don't agree with you - but you are still my brother or sister in Christ." Instead, we let people feed us nonsense - like if you are a christian you shouldn't care about the environment or social issues. Or, if you are a christian you should support abortions - no matter what. Come again? Either/Or? What about caring about all three issues? I've seen people write on these boards that they hate liberal democrats - with pride. I've heard in other places people speak of conservative christians with derision. This type of hatred is sin no matter how you slice it. If we speak this way are we any different from the world? Because really - the world sees us as all the same. I've heard some republicans totally bash George Bush because of his faith. I've heard some democrats bash Obama because of his. Let anyone stand up and talk about Jesus and see how quickly people turn on them. The real division is between christian and non-christian. We are called to love one another and be unified - not turn and devour each other because we have a difference in the direction that we feel is best for the country. And beyond this, we are also called to love our neighbors (christian or not) - and not only our brothers and sisters.
Personally, I would love to see a bipartisan christian group that looks at the issues that we have in common and gives them equal weights. We can then put pressure on both parties to move the country towards those ideals, regardless of how they go about it. Is there a congressional christian caucus that is bipartisan? If not, there should be one
Pro 31:9 Open thy mouth, judge righteously, and plead the cause of the poor and needy.
This is where me and the Republicans part company, we agree on alot of issues, abortion, gays, etc.
_____________________________
Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
|
|
|
|
|
RE: How Could a Christian Support Obama? - 9/2/2008 3:36:03 AM
|
|
|
SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5921
Joined: 4/15/2005
From: Northern Califonria
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: tracydolls
quote:
This is great - I saw this book in the bookstore and loved the title. For a long time, I felt like I was in the minority of people that felt that neither of the parties adequately address biblical views. I flipped through it - and found a passage where it talked about the younger generation embracing and rejecting both sides. It gave me hope. I've always thought there was something skewed about people who think that republicans (or democrats) are the only true christians. It is like people elevate politics above faith. To me, each side supports only half of the bible and violates the other half. This is because they weight issues differently - when all of these issues are important to God (poverty, unborn children, fairness, justice, good stewardship).
It is so clear that politicians play the christian card to manipulate the people. What is sad to me is when christians don't recognize that, but internally divide over these things instead of saying "I don't agree with you - but you are still my brother or sister in Christ." Instead, we let people feed us nonsense - like if you are a christian you shouldn't care about the environment or social issues. Or, if you are a christian you should support abortions - no matter what. Come again? Either/Or? What about caring about all three issues? I've seen people write on these boards that they hate liberal democrats - with pride. I've heard in other places people speak of conservative christians with derision. This type of hatred is sin no matter how you slice it. If we speak this way are we any different from the world? Because really - the world sees us as all the same. I've heard some republicans totally bash George Bush because of his faith. I've heard some democrats bash Obama because of his. Let anyone stand up and talk about Jesus and see how quickly people turn on them. The real division is between christian and non-christian. We are called to love one another and be unified - not turn and devour each other because we have a difference in the direction that we feel is best for the country. And beyond this, we are also called to love our neighbors (christian or not) - and not only our brothers and sisters.
Personally, I would love to see a bipartisan christian group that looks at the issues that we have in common and gives them equal weights. We can then put pressure on both parties to move the country towards those ideals, regardless of how they go about it. Is there a congressional christian caucus that is bipartisan? If not, there should be one
Pro 31:9 Open thy mouth, judge righteously, and plead the cause of the poor and needy.
This is where me and the Republicans part company, we agree on alot of issues, abortion, gays, etc.
What "party" pleads the cause of the poor and needy in regards to who is supposed to be the care taker of the poor and needy?
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 12:10 A righteous man regardeth the life of his beast: but the tender mercies of the wicked are cruel.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: How Could a Christian Support Obama? - 9/2/2008 3:38:54 AM
|
|
|
tracydolls
Posts: 1839
Joined: 3/30/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
Pro 31:9 Open thy mouth, judge righteously, and plead the cause of the poor and needy.
This is where me and the Republicans part company, we agree on alot of issues, abortion, gays, etc.
What "party" pleads the cause of the poor and needy in regards to who is supposed to be the care taker of the poor and needy?
Bible verse that says:in regards to who is supposed to be the care taker of the poor and needy?
I said this is where ME, Myself and I part company with the Republicans, never mentioned what the Dems do or don't do.
_____________________________
Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
|
|
|
|
|
RE: How Could a Christian Support Obama? - 9/2/2008 7:32:25 AM
|
|
|
huskarine
Posts: 444
Joined: 7/31/2008
From: Wheaton, IL
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: tracydolls
quote:
Pro 31:9 Open thy mouth, judge righteously, and plead the cause of the poor and needy.
This is where me and the Republicans part company, we agree on alot of issues, abortion, gays, etc.
What "party" pleads the cause of the poor and needy in regards to who is supposed to be the care taker of the poor and needy?
Bible verse that says:in regards to who is supposed to be the care taker of the poor and needy?
I said this is where ME, Myself and I part company with the Republicans, never mentioned what the Dems do or don't do.
"pleading the cause of the poor and needy" is a very subjective stance, but as for me, i'd rather help the poor and needy get jobs and develop a life instead of commiting them to welfare. (thinking long-term goal)...
_____________________________
"Success is equated with excess/the ambition for excess wrecks us/as the top of the mind becomes the bottom line/when success is equated with excess" -Switchfoot "American Dream"
|
|
|
|
|
RE: How Could a Christian Support Obama? - 9/2/2008 1:26:03 PM
|
|
|
SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5921
Joined: 4/15/2005
From: Northern Califonria
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: tracydolls
Bible verse that says:in regards to who is supposed to be the care taker of the poor and needy?
Yes... Who is charged with helping the poor and needy...
quote:
I said this is where ME, Myself and I part company with the Republicans, never mentioned what the Dems do or don't do.
So your charge against Republicans isn't in contrast to what the Democrats do or don't do? You don't agree with the Democrats regarding the poor?
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 12:10 A righteous man regardeth the life of his beast: but the tender mercies of the wicked are cruel.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Christians and Voting - 9/2/2008 2:49:53 PM
|
|
|
macokjc
Posts: 289
Joined: 2/24/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
Bushs tax cuts for rich, the peanuts we give in aid, the cutting of welfare, the list is really long.
Wow - do people really believe that? Where do you get your information.
quote:
Narrowmindedness Kills!
I love the saying goes "Some people are so open-minded - their brains have fallen out. "
I have only read 1/2 of this thread, and I am seriously sick to my stomach. That's all I can handle for now.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Christians and Voting - 9/2/2008 2:56:47 PM
|
|
|
GregandJenny
Posts: 676
Joined: 2/16/2006
From: Near Seattle Washington
Status: online
|
Tracy dolls wrote:
quote:
My community, the african american community is VOTING in record numbers this year. WE even have the Republican conservative black vote this year.
Not all of us republican conservatives have been swayed.
G
_____________________________
It does not have to be well with my circumstance to be well with my soul!
|
|
|
|
|
RE: How Could a Christian Support Obama? - 9/2/2008 3:06:14 PM
|
|
|
raivyne
Posts: 1010
Joined: 8/28/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: huskarine
quote:
ORIGINAL: tracydolls
quote:
Pro 31:9 Open thy mouth, judge righteously, and plead the cause of the poor and needy.
This is where me and the Republicans part company, we agree on alot of issues, abortion, gays, etc.
What "party" pleads the cause of the poor and needy in regards to who is supposed to be the care taker of the poor and needy?
Bible verse that says:in regards to who is supposed to be the care taker of the poor and needy?
I said this is where ME, Myself and I part company with the Republicans, never mentioned what the Dems do or don't do.
"pleading the cause of the poor and needy" is a very subjective stance, but as for me, i'd rather help the poor and needy get jobs and develop a life instead of commiting them to welfare. (thinking long-term goal)...
...teach a man to fish...
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Christians and Voting - 9/2/2008 5:14:00 PM
|
|
|
Thessa
Posts: 811
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: tracydolls
Well
I don't know about ya'll. But I think it is ironic that Gustav is about to hit New Orleans on the first day of the Republicans Convention. Very close to the date of Katrina and Rita.
I think to remind us of Katrina, to give some of those in power a second chance to redeem theirselves, and to remind the poor of this world.
That people are trying to DEVOUR them.
.
Pro 30:12 There is a generation that are pure in their own eyes, and yet is not washed from their filthiness.
Pro 30:13 There is a generation, O how lofty are their eyes! and their eyelids are lifted up.
Pro 30:14 There is a generation, whose teeth are as swords, and their jaw teeth as knives, to devour the poor from off the earth, and the needy from among men. Pro 30:15 The horseleach hath two daughters, crying, Give, giv. There are three things that are never satisfied, yea, four things say not, It is enough:
Are you totally out of your mind?
If you really think these Hurricanes have anything to do with the Republican Convention you have alot to learn about God.
Answer me a question...what convention was going on when Katrina hit New Orleans? You have to have some proof to back up what you are saying. Otherwise it just looks weird.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Christians and Voting - 9/2/2008 5:19:11 PM
|
|
|
tafkam
Posts: 1981
Joined: 9/23/2005
Status: offline
|
tracydolls' posts and the word "weird" have gone together like frick and frack for a couple of days now....
_____________________________
"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are, 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.' - Ronald Reagan
Tafkam
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Christians and Voting - 9/3/2008 3:59:39 PM
|
|
|
rgod
Posts: 1774
Joined: 4/25/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Thessa
Are you totally out of your mind?
If you really think these Hurricanes have anything to do with the Republican Convention you have alot to learn about God.
Answer me a question...what convention was going on when Katrina hit New Orleans? You have to have some proof to back up what you are saying. Otherwise it just looks weird.
This is interesting, because it sounds very much like the emails that I received right after Katrina that kept saying that it was judgement on New Orleans - how it was a sign or judgement from God. (Check this thread for a recap: http://www.faithcommunitynetwork.com/m_3528651/mpage_1/key_katrina%2cjudgement/tm.htm#3529974). While I don't agree that the timing of the hurricanes are a judgement against the republican convention, I don't think that this is something that is original to TracyDolls or that she is out of her mind or wierd for raising the possibility. We've had a history within the christian community of questioning whether God's judgement is being employed in the context of other natural disasters as well as diseases and illnesses. Why I find this line of thought to be interesting is because usually I hear talk about judgement for certain some disasters and diseases (aids which affected gays the most in the beginning of the epidemic, katrina which affected poor people, or the tsunami in sumatra which affected muslims primarily), but not others (such as the wildfires that affect california every year - mostly in affluent communities (or so it seems), the recurrent florida hurricanes, or various twisters and tornadoes that hit the midwest each year.)
< Message edited by rgod -- 9/3/2008 4:25:53 PM >
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Christians and Voting - 9/3/2008 4:25:08 PM
|
|
|
rgod
Posts: 1774
Joined: 4/25/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
quote:
ORIGINAL: rgod
quote:
ORIGINAL: tafkam
quote:
WE want some babies to come here so we don't have to feed them. They need to get up, pull theirselves up by the bootstraps and find a job in this good economy.
Okay, I take back what I said in an earlier thread.....THIS is the most asinine post I've seen on these forums (and that's saying something)
You heard it here folks! The GOP wants BABIES to go out and get jobs! Wow!
tafkam - I think that maybe this was sarcasm? Maybe the original poster might tell me if I'm on the right track. She seemed to be saying that conservatives want babies to be born, but after they are born, they don't want to to provide assistance is the family is poor. (Perhaps there are some people who might choose to have an abortion because they don't think that they can financially afford a child???).
To bad that wouldn't refrain from the act that creates children if they cannot financially afford a child.. Especially since that isn't hardly a valid reason to murder the child...
I agree with this - and I personally don't see any reason for an abortion except possibly if the life of the mother is endangered - but, even then I think that if I were faced with that situation, I would probably decide to lay down my own life and just pray. (I'm not saying that with any kind of condemnation to anyone who might have chosen to have an abortion - I'm just talking about what I think that I might do if I were in that situation - my life vs. my child's life. But, I've not been in that situation though, so I can't say for sure. Like, what if I had 2 little kids and the 3rd one would endanger my life? Or I was married to a man who was physically abusive to me and my kids? These things happen more than one would think. I think that would be such a difficult situation to be in and I really feel for people who have to make that decision.)
When I read your statement, the first thing that came to my mind was that birth control is fallible. I don't know if vacectomies are available for everyone (can you get this without insurance? if you are poor you might not have that.) So, are we to say that poor married people shouldn't have sex? I'm not an abortion advocate - because I personally believe that if you are pregnant, then God will provide a way for you to raise that child, regardless of the circumstances - because God can do anything. But I don't think these things are so cut and dry. It seems to me that many who are pro-life paint a picture of women who use abortion as birth control and kill their babies on a whim because they want to sleep around. And the pro-choicer folks often want to try to deny the fact that the life inside of the woman is a baby and not simply tissue. (Really now ... who gets an ultrasound and says - "Look at this tissue? I think I'll name it Bob." In reality, "it" is often called "tissue" if it is unwanted, but a "baby" when it is wanted.) However, having spoken to women who have decided for or against abortion, most view it as a very heavy decision - many who choose abortion see no way out - and many who choose to have the baby have heavy decisions/realizations to make too.
Just food for thought.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: How Could a Christian Support Obama? - 9/3/2008 4:28:48 PM
|
|
|
| |
Forum Tools
Printable Version
RE: How Could a Christian Support Obama? - 
