|
Users viewing this topic:
none
|
|
Login  | |
|
Saddleback, McCain's deceptions and his infidelity - 8/21/2008 6:20:11 PM
|
|
|
Dubya
Posts: 1033
Joined: 10/25/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline
|
"This was the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal."
-- Barack Obama
"Many even see in Obama a messiah-like figure, a great soul, and some affectionately call him Mahatma Obama."
-- Dinesh Sharma
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Mocking the Messiah - 8/21/2008 6:27:52 PM
|
|
|
Evangel70
Posts: 554
Joined: 10/28/2006
Status: offline
|
quote:
"We are the ones we've been waiting for." - Messiah Obama
"You see, the challenges we face will not be solved with one meeting in one night. Change will not come if we wait for some other person or some other time.
We are the ones we've been waiting for. We are the change that we seek. We are the hope of those boys who have little; who've been told that they cannot have what they dream; that they cannot be what they imagine. "
Unless you believe Obama is now referring to himself in the "royal we" I don't see how his statement confirming that change starts with us means that he refers to himself as a messaih.
The very fact that YOU were quick to refer to Obama as Messiah only confirms my post above.
_____________________________
May the God who gives endurance and encouragement give you a spirit of unity among yourselves as you follow Christ Jesus, so that with one heart and mouth you may glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Mocking the Messiah - 8/21/2008 6:29:53 PM
|
|
|
Evangel70
Posts: 554
Joined: 10/28/2006
Status: offline
|
quote:
"... a light will shine through that window, a beam of light will come down upon you, you will experience an epiphany ... and you will suddenly realize that you must go to the polls and vote for Obama" - Barack Obama Lebanon, New Hampshire.
January 7, 2008.
When taken in context Obama was actually mocking Hillary Clinton's statement. Nice try thought.
_____________________________
May the God who gives endurance and encouragement give you a spirit of unity among yourselves as you follow Christ Jesus, so that with one heart and mouth you may glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.
|
|
|
|
|
Context, context, context.... - 8/21/2008 6:36:20 PM
|
|
|
Evangel70
Posts: 554
Joined: 10/28/2006
Status: offline
|
quote:
This was the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal."
"The journey will be difficult. The road will be long. I face this challenge with profound humility, and knowledge of my own limitations. But I also face it with limitless faith in the capacity of the American people. Because if we are willing to work for it, and fight for it, and believe in it, then I am absolutely certain that generations from now, we will be able to look back and tell our children that this was the moment when we began to provide care for the sick and good jobs to the jobless; this was the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal; this was the moment when we ended a war and secured our nation and restored our image as the last, best hope on earth. This was the moment—this was the time—when we came together to remake this great nation so that it may always reflect our very best selves and our highest ideals. Thank you, God bless you, and may God bless the United States of America. "
Given Obama's concern with global warming, the planet begining to heal would be in line with his political policies wouldn't you agree?
_____________________________
May the God who gives endurance and encouragement give you a spirit of unity among yourselves as you follow Christ Jesus, so that with one heart and mouth you may glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Context, context, context.... - 8/21/2008 6:44:16 PM
|
|
|
Dubya
Posts: 1033
Joined: 10/25/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline
|
An article written by an Obama supporter concerned about his cult-like following:Barack Obama Is Not Jesus
From the article: Excuse me, but this sounds more like a cult than a political campaign. The language used here is the language of evangelical Christianity – the Obama volunteers speak of "coming to Obama" in the same way born-again Christians talk about "coming to Jesus."
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Saddleback, McCain's deceptions and his infidelity - 8/21/2008 6:46:20 PM
|
|
|
SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5392
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: DevoutDoc
Sorry guys, I just can't bring myself to vote for McCain. I'm not sure what the answer is... but all these questions about McCain's character. I'm not an Obama fan, however, on the question of marriage he does seem to have a long-term, loving Christian marriage.
What is "Christian" about his marriage?
John
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Saddleback, McCain's deceptions and his infidelity - 8/21/2008 6:55:47 PM
|
|
|
Dubya
Posts: 1033
Joined: 10/25/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline
|
In May 2007, Men's Vogue had this: "When Morgan Freeman comes over to greet Obama, the senator begins bowing down both hands in worship. "This guy was president before I was," says Obama, referring to Freeman's turn in Deep Impact and, clearly, getting a little ahead of his own bio. Next, a nod to Bruce Almighty: "This guy was God before I was." (Okay, more than a little ahead.) But Freeman is eating it up. Leaning in, he tells the senator to win it. "I will," Obama replies. "That's why I'm running." "
LINK.
The cult-like "messiah" image has been around for a while and it seems to be promoted more by his supporters.
Considering all of that, if McCain mocks him... why not? He asked for it. (or at least he has done nothing to stop it ffrom his admirers).
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Lessor of 2 evils - 8/21/2008 7:38:00 PM
|
|
|
ManimalX
Posts: 1226
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Evangel70
quote:
You won't find very many on the right who are excited about McCain, rather viewing him as the only option that will stop a disastrous Obama presidency. The lesser of two evils, if you will.
Using your logic, the lessor of 2 evils is STILL EVIL. You're basically saying that voting for one of satan's minions is better than voting for satan himself.
No. Using my logic I am keeping the greater evil from acquiring power to disastrous ends. To continue your analogy, given the choice I would MUCH rather face a minor demon than the prince of the power of the air himself, especially when choosing neither gives me the worst.
quote:
McCain has commited himself to continuing President Bush's failed policies. It doesn't get more disasterous than that.
There is a lot of subjective opinion as to whether certain Bush policies "failed" or not, and I would argue that he has had more success than failure. Not all of us suffer from Bush Derangement Syndrome ;)
quote:
Vote for whomever you want because you agree with their political policies, but don't fool yourself into thinking one candidate is less "evil" than another. God doesn't rank sin and the bible teaches that ALL sin will separate us from God.
Really?
" If anyone sees his brother committing a sin not leading to death, he shall ask, and God* will give him life--to those who commit sins that do not lead to death. There is sin that leads to death; I do not say that one should pray for that. All wrongdoing is sin, but there is sin that does not lead to death." - 1st John 5:16-17
If you prefer, I could provide other Scriptural reference about the severity of sin and levels of punishment and reward in eternity. THe bottom line is that your assertion is incorrect because there ARE people who are more righteous than others or wicked than others.
quote:
As wisely posted by another previously "You're not voting for the leader of the baptist church" but rather for a SECULAR position.
And as I already stated in another post, the sacred/secular argument is erroneous dualism. In fact, there is strong evidence that the divided "secular" culture that we now "enjoy" is the fault of Christians who perpetuated a dualistic worldview throughout history. The truth is that the Kingdom of God can and should be taken into every aspect of reality, and in fact our duty as Christians is the renewal of that Kingdom in the aspects which have been perverted. To that end, a responsible Christian in America should always try to place the most righteous leader possible in areas of authority, and if so inclined try to BECOME that righteous authority. This doesn't mean a good leader HAS to be Christian, but it does mean that they should demonstrate the character of a righteous leader as laid out in the Bible.
Barack Obama does not fit this description.
_____________________________
"But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed." - 2nd Peter 3:10
|
|
|
|
|
Mocking the Messiah - 8/21/2008 8:47:27 PM
|
|
|
Evangel70
Posts: 554
Joined: 10/28/2006
Status: offline
|
quote:
Yet another Obama supporter praising Obama Messiah:
Dubya,
You're not getting it. You will always have wackos who will equate Obama to a messianic figure and wackos who think he's the anti-Christ. My point is that OBAMA has made no such claim and McCain has sunk to the level of thinking the term messiah can be thrown around for political gain.
You will find thousands of websites equating President Bush to the anti-Christ and sites equating President Bush to a prophet of God. Does that mean that President Bush is either a messianic figure or the anti-Christ simply because his supporters or opposers say so?
_____________________________
May the God who gives endurance and encouragement give you a spirit of unity among yourselves as you follow Christ Jesus, so that with one heart and mouth you may glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Lessor of 2 evils - 8/21/2008 8:51:20 PM
|
|
|
Evangel70
Posts: 554
Joined: 10/28/2006
Status: offline
|
quote:
Really?
" If anyone sees his brother committing a sin not leading to death, he shall ask, and God* will give him life--to those who commit sins that do not lead to death. There is sin that leads to death; I do not say that one should pray for that. All wrongdoing is sin, but there is sin that does not lead to death." - 1st John 5:16-17
What do you believe is that "sin leading to death"?
quote:
This doesn't mean a good leader HAS to be Christian, but it does mean that they should demonstrate the character of a righteous leader as laid out in the Bible.
If this is your criteria, McCain is NOT your man.
_____________________________
May the God who gives endurance and encouragement give you a spirit of unity among yourselves as you follow Christ Jesus, so that with one heart and mouth you may glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Lesser of 2 evils - 8/21/2008 8:54:09 PM
|
|
|
blessedinnyc
Posts: 1961
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Evangel70
quote:
Really?
" If anyone sees his brother committing a sin not leading to death, he shall ask, and God* will give him life--to those who commit sins that do not lead to death. There is sin that leads to death; I do not say that one should pray for that. All wrongdoing is sin, but there is sin that does not lead to death." - 1st John 5:16-17
What do you believe is that "sin leading to death"?
quote:
This doesn't mean a good leader HAS to be Christian, but it does mean that they should demonstrate the character of a righteous leader as laid out in the Bible.
If this is your criteria, McCain is NOT your man.
*Fixed* (see title), unless you are renting evils.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Mocking the Messiah - 8/21/2008 8:58:00 PM
|
|
|
Dubya
Posts: 1033
Joined: 10/25/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Evangel70
quote:
Yet another Obama supporter praising Obama Messiah:
Dubya,
You're not getting it. You will always have wackos who will equate Obama to a messianic figure and wackos who think he's the anti-Christ. My point is that OBAMA has made no such claim and McCain has sunk to the level of thinking the term messiah can be thrown around for political gain.
You will find thousands of websites equating President Bush to the anti-Christ and sites equating President Bush to a prophet of God. Does that mean that President Bush is either a messianic figure or the anti-Christ simply because his supporters or opposers say so?
Sorry Evangel70, I think you may not recall that my first post on this was #33 in which I said quote:
Another major difference is that no one on the right considers their candidate a messiah.
Perhaps Obama has made no such claim, but until McCain began mocking him he made no effort to stop it either. In post #83 I pointed out quote:
In May 2007, Men's Vogue had this: "When Morgan Freeman comes over to greet Obama, the senator begins bowing down both hands in worship. "This guy was president before I was," says Obama, referring to Freeman's turn in Deep Impact and, clearly, getting a little ahead of his own bio. Next, a nod to Bruce Almighty: "This guy was God before I was." (Okay, more than a little ahead.) But Freeman is eating it up. Leaning in, he tells the senator to win it. "I will," Obama replies. "That's why I'm running." "
Now I will grant, that Obama and Freeman were joking around... but so is John McCain. If Obama finds this so offensive now, why did he participate in it then?
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Mocking the Messiah - 8/21/2008 9:03:58 PM
|
|
|
ManimalX
Posts: 1226
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
|
The point is that Obama has PRESENTED himself as a transcendent agent of HOPE and CHANGE and UNITY. He has created the messianic image ON PURPOSE and is riding that wave. Do you remember the fainting women at all of the Primary speeches? Unfortunately for him, the more folks are finding out about him, the more they see that he is NOT offering anything different than every other politician, the more they see the only change he will bring is higher taxes and energy solutions that depend on a tire gage... well, let's just say the "abandon ship!" alarm has been sounded and the evacuation is making the Titanic's look calm.
The man is pompous and arrogant and seems to buy into his own hype even when there is nothing behind it. His policies are like the town in Blazing Saddles: looks good from the front, but propped up with nothing from behind. That is the point of the McCain ads.
_____________________________
"But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed." - 2nd Peter 3:10
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Lessor of 2 evils - 8/21/2008 9:14:25 PM
|
|
|
SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5392
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: ManimalX
quote:
ORIGINAL: Evangel70
quote:
You won't find very many on the right who are excited about McCain, rather viewing him as the only option that will stop a disastrous Obama presidency. The lesser of two evils, if you will.
Using your logic, the lessor of 2 evils is STILL EVIL. You're basically saying that voting for one of satan's minions is better than voting for satan himself.
No. Using my logic I am keeping the greater evil from acquiring power to disastrous ends. To continue your analogy, given the choice I would MUCH rather face a minor demon than the prince of the power of the air himself, especially when choosing neither gives me the worst.
quote:
McCain has commited himself to continuing President Bush's failed policies. It doesn't get more disasterous than that.
There is a lot of subjective opinion as to whether certain Bush policies "failed" or not, and I would argue that he has had more success than failure. Not all of us suffer from Bush Derangement Syndrome ;)
quote:
Vote for whomever you want because you agree with their political policies, but don't fool yourself into thinking one candidate is less "evil" than another. God doesn't rank sin and the bible teaches that ALL sin will separate us from God.
Really?
" If anyone sees his brother committing a sin not leading to death, he shall ask, and God* will give him life--to those who commit sins that do not lead to death. There is sin that leads to death; I do not say that one should pray for that. All wrongdoing is sin, but there is sin that does not lead to death." - 1st John 5:16-17
If you prefer, I could provide other Scriptural reference about the severity of sin and levels of punishment and reward in eternity. THe bottom line is that your assertion is incorrect because there ARE people who are more righteous than others or wicked than others.
quote:
As wisely posted by another previously "You're not voting for the leader of the baptist church" but rather for a SECULAR position.
And as I already stated in another post, the sacred/secular argument is erroneous dualism. In fact, there is strong evidence that the divided "secular" culture that we now "enjoy" is the fault of Christians who perpetuated a dualistic worldview throughout history. The truth is that the Kingdom of God can and should be taken into every aspect of reality, and in fact our duty as Christians is the renewal of that Kingdom in the aspects which have been perverted. To that end, a responsible Christian in America should always try to place the most righteous leader possible in areas of authority, and if so inclined try to BECOME that righteous authority. This doesn't mean a good leader HAS to be Christian, but it does mean that they should demonstrate the character of a righteous leader as laid out in the Bible.
Barack Obama does not fit this description.
Amen....
John
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Mocking the Messiah - 8/21/2008 9:18:49 PM
|
|
|
Evangel70
Posts: 554
Joined: 10/28/2006
Status: offline
|
quote:
The point is that Obama has PRESENTED himself as a transcendent agent of HOPE and CHANGE and UNITY. He has created the messianic image ON PURPOSE and is riding that wave.
While Obama has indeed presented himself as an agent of change, it was NOT he who came up with the messiah image but rather the McCain campaign. Anyone thinking that Obama (or McCain for that matter) is going to have everyone holding hands and singing kum-ba-ya ought to stay home in November because they're not smart enough to figure out how to vote anyway.
I think Republicans have forgotten all the awe and wonder that was shed upon Ronald Reagan when his followers believed he could walk on water. Not to mention all the worship that was wasted on the "republican revolution" of Newt Gingridge in the 90s.
_____________________________
May the God who gives endurance and encouragement give you a spirit of unity among yourselves as you follow Christ Jesus, so that with one heart and mouth you may glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Mocking the Messiah - 8/21/2008 9:22:59 PM
|
|
|
Dubya
Posts: 1033
Joined: 10/25/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Evangel70
quote:
The point is that Obama has PRESENTED himself as a transcendent agent of HOPE and CHANGE and UNITY. He has created the messianic image ON PURPOSE and is riding that wave.
While Obama has indeed presented himself as an agent of change, it was NOT he who came up with the messiah image but rather the McCain campaign.
How do you explain this quote from Obama at a fund raiser in May 2007, "Next, a nod to Bruce Almighty: "This guy was God before I was.""
That was NOT John McCain speaking... it was The One!
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Mocking the Messiah - 8/21/2008 9:26:54 PM
|
|
|
ManimalX
Posts: 1226
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Dubya
Exactly! If Obama wanted the "Messiah" message to stop he could have done it long ago. Remember how quickly he stopped any referrence to his ears? ... and reference to his middle name?
The Messiah link has gone on, by his supporters, since at least May 2007.
And my original point was that McCain's supporters have never considered him in that divine light.
Haha! I forgot about the ear thing. See, if Obama would have tried to stop the messiah imagery from the get-go I might have forgotten that, too.
And you speak truly (again) about McCain. In fact, if I knew that there were to be no Supreme Court vacancies in the next four years I would probably do the irresponsible thing and vote for a third party. But, since I feel obligated to help stop the greater evil, I will have to be satisfied being one of McCain's "my friends".
_____________________________
"But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed." - 2nd Peter 3:10
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Mocking the Messiah - 8/21/2008 9:37:44 PM
|
|
|
ManimalX
Posts: 1226
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Evangel70
Anyone thinking that Obama (or McCain for that matter) is going to have everyone holding hands and singing kum-ba-ya ought to stay home in November because they're not smart enough to figure out how to vote anyway.
But that is exactly what many Obama supporters DO think!!!!
You do realize your scenario would disqualify most Obama voters from voting? Seriously, have you listened to any of Sean Hannity's "man-on-the-street" Thursdays or watched Jay Leno's "Jay Walking" or seen ANY of the spot interviews done with Obama supporters? Almost to a one the exchange goes like this:
Q: "Why are you going to vote for Barack Obama?"
A: "Because he is, like, for change, and he will, like, bring us all together."
Q: "Can you name any major accomplishments of Barack Obama that warrant this view?"
A: "Well... he is, like, for change..."
I kid you not I have heard this exact exchange and permutations of it repeated dozens of times.
It frustrates me that I have spent so much time watching, listening to, reading about, and researching candidates, but my vote is going to be canceled out by the emotional whim of some liberal twit.
I hope your scenario comes true and all of the not-smart people you refer to stay home on election day.
_____________________________
"But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed." - 2nd Peter 3:10
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Mocking the Messiah - 8/21/2008 9:39:49 PM
|
|
|
SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5392
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Evangel70
While Obama has indeed presented himself as an agent of change,
Which is funny because he's just like the last Democrat that held the office and the one he beat in the primary...
quote:
Anyone thinking that Obama (or McCain for that matter) is going to have everyone holding hands and singing kum-ba-ya ought to stay home in November because they're not smart enough to figure out how to vote anyway.
Would that include those who are driven to the polls and HELPED with the ballot?
John
< Message edited by SovereignIsHe -- 8/21/2008 10:25:45 PM >
|
|
|
|
|
Forum Tools
Printable Version
