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norajm -> Respect and Sex (8/6/2008 9:15:20 PM)

Please give me some input on why some men say they want women they can respect, trust, etc, etc...but when the woman makes it clear that she is not going to have premarital sex the man is no longer interested. OR he thinks she is playing hard to get which appears to be a challenge but when he realizes that she is really really serious there is no longer interest.



APZR -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/7/2008 12:55:58 AM)

It's simple... pick up lines. Those guys have one thing on their mind, and your mind is not it. You can change your scene and change your methods, but even when fishing in church there are sharks. Although shark cut into cubes and fried is quite good. [sm=chef.gif]



DaveW -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/7/2008 6:28:08 AM)

Of course men want women they can trust and respect. That is with their mind. But many men when it comes to the bottom line think more with their hormones than their minds.



willfs -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/8/2008 9:39:55 AM)

Okay, one at a time.

Respect vs. premarital sex: The guys probably do want someone they can respect... AND they want sex from that person. I am not saying it is right. I believe sex should only be in marriage. I think it is okay to want to marry someone you respect AND want to have an intimate relationship with them. 99.99 percent of guys are hardwired to desire physical intimacy to a degree that most woman don't realize.

Playing hard to get: I think you nailed it. The guys like the challenge. But it may be more than just wanting a challenge. Maybe its like he thinks, "She doesn't like me. She must be too good for me. I want someone better than me because I don't like myself." But when she starts likeing him he thinks, "She likes me. She must be on my level. I don't want someone who is on my level. I don't like myself. I want someone better than me." Its called the Woody Allen syndrome = "I would never join a country club that takes me as a member. I am a loser so any country club that takes me in must be a country club for losers."



revbob4God -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/8/2008 10:21:02 AM)

Okay, here it is. I took my preacher hat off and am talking as a human being.
Bottom line, men just need to be moe respectful of women, and that is as plain as I can say it. Women are not meant to be playthings, slaves, or perpetual sounding boards to whiners and ninnies. When God created the heavens and the earth, and created man and woman, people really need to depart from the fact that God had to take a part from the man to create the woman. Fellas, here's a thought. The rib he removed is connected to a backbone. Never forget that. Just as the church is meant to be the helpmate of God to extend his mission and salvation to the world, it can only, grow and thrive if it is nurtured and encouraged to exist at its true and full capacity and that takes not only a responsible steward, but also a caring companion. The wife carries that same blessing and importance. Husbands and wives are Gods original team. Oh. by the way, there is no "I" in team.

....Something tells me I may just have a sermon brewing.



APZR -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/8/2008 10:43:08 AM)

Yeah, if you work on it and brush it up, there could be a good sermon there.

BTW, there is no "I" in team... but there is a M and E. [8D]



NoShow -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/8/2008 11:21:34 AM)

It's because they say it rather than mean it.

And when that becomes apparent, you should just thank them for showing you that they're not worth wasting any more time on\with.



MWD -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/8/2008 1:20:53 PM)

Nora, you have just lurched uncontrollably into one of the differences between a true man for all seasons and a mere modern male. ;-)



norajm -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/8/2008 7:56:17 PM)

Thank you for your responses. They are very interesting. Once a guy press the issue of premarital sex I do end the relationship. I just find it odd that I initially let them know that there will be no premarital sex and they seem fine with it. Once it becomes a reality, oh my goodness, how they change. I have been asked "what makes you so special" and told "I see why you are alone, men need it and u don't give it" and other things. Like I said it's not like I didn't tell them yet they seem so shocked when I stick to it.

Again, thank you for taking the time to enlighten me.



OneJohn410 -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/9/2008 12:35:00 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: norajm

Please give me some input on why some men say they want women they can respect, trust, etc, etc...but when the woman makes it clear that she is not going to have premarital sex the man is no longer interested. OR he thinks she is playing hard to get which appears to be a challenge but when he realizes that she is really really serious there is no longer interest.

Being respectful is something probably everyone gets socialized in doing as a youngster, teen, and young adult. Respect.... your elders, your parents, the law, your teachers, the rights of others. Please and thank you, yes ma'am and no sir. Not everyone, but most of us get pretty good at it. What if (at first, anyway) some guys looking to date someone they can respect means, 'Won't you please, please just date me only as we are dating- and that there be some things I share with you that you keep to yourself and I do the same?' That you can be counted on to honor those things and feel you can trust me the same way. No back-stabbing or whathaveyou, let's just see if there's anything for going steady. That's my genderless thinking about respect.

Now, on the abstinence question, you said how come a guy can set up all the qualifications he hopes to find one day in a gal, and then it's the gal that brings up the abstinence qualification. And after that really sinks into the guy's mind, you are suddenly not very interesting any more.

I type this up with this thought- it's all really what both guy and gal consider to be the purpose for dating. If it's to find someone to propose to or to hope proposes to you, then it isn't so much about what he wants or what she wants as it is who he is or who she is, and who either or both have the potential of becoming. Otherwise, it's just to help you get out in the world and enjoy not being by yourself. If you are dating someone who goes to a church, and you do, and you are both Christians, and you are both looking to get married some day- that really makes dating a whole lot more challenging, right?

You can read that the wife is to respect or submit to her husband- willingly following his leadership in Christ. You can read that the husband is to love his wife as Christ loved the church. He submits his own interests in order to care for her.

So, a guy looking for a woman he can respect, trust, etc. etc. is interesting, when after marriage he's to love his wife, submitting his own interests to care for her. Also, is he leading this gal in a dating relationship if he doesn't bring up abstinence? These two people are just chock full of hormones, sure, but is she looking for someone who can not just say no sex, thanks, but also not cause her to remind him he'd said he was waiting until he and Ms. JesusFreak were married?

Hindsight can be 20/20. I appreciate your post, because next time I'm looking into dating someone, I've eaten this advice myself, and it was actually of some substance. So the next time I meet who I believe to be Ms. JesusFreak, there'll soon be some fairly hefty talk to happen before the two of us spend much more time together.

This could really be a sorry, no good, why did I not see this before situation, and I hate it for you and you should know better guys. Please chat it up with some sisters here in the community if you haven't already?

In Christ,
OneJohn410



revbob4God -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/9/2008 11:25:56 AM)

Preacher Hat back on and working on a respect sermon...
God Bless



jn1010lf -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/10/2008 9:15:00 AM)

Hello norajm

Whether one is a man or woman, Christians have an obligation to dedicate their bodies to the Lord. He purshased it by His blood on the cross, so it's His.

Now if the Lord impressed upon you to treat your body in a certain way, no other person has a right to question it. So, I might take a long look at the guys with whom you keep company.



DreadPirateRandy -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/10/2008 7:05:16 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: jn1010lf

Whether one is a man or woman, Christians have an obligation to dedicate their bodies to the Lord. He purchased it by His blood on the cross, so it's His.


I wanted to add onto this a bit.

In marriage, two individuals become one flesh. Their bodies do not belong to them, but to each other.



outsider20 -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/11/2008 1:53:17 AM)

Well since the Bible says that premarital sex is wrong, it's not unreasonable to wait until marriage. I would hope that any decent Christian man would have that desire to wait and respect a woman's desire to wait as well. If the guy we are speaking of is not a Christian then his worldly thinking should not come as a surprise.



willfs -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/11/2008 9:59:11 AM)

I've have come in contact with the same thing from women, who said they were Christian. They said they had no problem waiting for marriage but once the relationship picked up they changed their tune.

Welcome to planet Earth, where people say one thing (and they believe themselves) but mean something else.



huskarine -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/11/2008 12:27:10 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: outsider20

Well since the Bible says that premarital sex is wrong, it's not unreasonable to wait until marriage. I would hope that any decent Christian man would have that desire to wait and respect a woman's desire to wait as well. If the guy we are speaking of is not a Christian then his worldly thinking should not come as a surprise.



for my defense against premarital sex, where in the Bible does it say no to premarital sex??? also, in the future if you reference the Bible like the quoted post, please back it up with a scripture quote of some sorts...thanks.



iwillfearnoevil -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/11/2008 12:42:40 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: norajm

Please give me some input on why some men say they want women they can respect, trust, etc, etc...but when the woman makes it clear that she is not going to have premarital sex the man is no longer interested. OR he thinks she is playing hard to get which appears to be a challenge but when he realizes that she is really really serious there is no longer interest.


sorry to be blunt, but some men will say anything to get a woman into bed



iwillfearnoevil -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/11/2008 12:53:41 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: huskarine
for my defense against premarital sex, where in the Bible does it say no to premarital sex??? also, in the future if you reference the Bible like the quoted post, please back it up with a scripture quote of some sorts...thanks.


i don't think you'll find the words premarital sex in the Bible but you won't find the word trinity either. there are many NT scriptures that teach against sexual sins (1 Cor 6:18-20, Eph 5:3). They say to flee it ... Read 1 Cor 6:9-10, Hebrews 13:4. Go onto 2 Cor 11:2 "I am jealous for you with a godly jealousy. I promised you to one husband, to Christ, so that I might present you as a pure virgin to him" ... this puts an emphasis on purity and virginity before marriage.

1 Cor 7:8 the infamous better to marry than burn with passion to me means that if someone is unmarried (pre-married) and burning with sexual desire that to avoid sexual sins, one should get married. this implies sex outside of marriage is a sin. also looking at 1 Cor 7:1-2, Paul gives reason to get married - to avoid fornification. fornication in any dictionary includes sex between unmarried people - so this is part of your understanding.

hope this helps ...



willfs -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/11/2008 6:11:38 PM)

Yeah, those are good verses. It's also important to note that one of the reasons that you won't find the words "premarital sex" in the New Testament is because their culture was so much against premarital sex that there wasn't a huge need to preach against it.



iwillfearnoevil -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/12/2008 9:16:53 AM)

good point about culture. also fornication is included under the broader greek word porneia which includes other sexual sins such as adultery, homosexuality, etc



buckifn -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/12/2008 11:50:29 AM)

why? Because you are prob. not dealing with a guy who wants to follow God's commands and God's will if he is wanting to have sex with you outside of marriage. It's natural for the flesh to only care for the flesh. Having a sex partner is looking to the moment to find pleasure..having a wife is a lifetime commitment and both people learn to mature in their respect, honor, and love for one another.



John_O -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/12/2008 1:17:00 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: willfs

Yeah, those are good verses. It's also important to note that one of the reasons that you won't find the words "premarital sex" in the New Testament is because their culture was so much against premarital sex that there wasn't a huge need to preach against it.


Also in most of the OT at least, If a man had sex with a woman she was considered to be his wife from that point on and he was responsible for her (financially and every other way).

So the question for the men back then wasn't "Do I want to have sex with this woman?" but "do I want to have sex with this woman and be with her for the rest of my life?"

That really is a stand we need to get back to. Sleep with her once, plan on sleeping with her for the rest of your life.



terryjohn -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/23/2008 3:39:31 PM)

I think it is true to say that sex is one thing and love is another. Confussing the two would do violence to the word love. Now a man could have sex with many women but no one would seriously believe him if he were to say he loved them or had any respect for them. Sex in itself does some violence to the concept of love for in it we bring that which we honour down to our level when all a long we should regard it much higher if in fact we do love it.

Love is not self-seeking. Love is self sacrificing, love does not covet that which is loved but always wants more for that which is loved than itself. To love sex and not the woman is the same as not knowing what love is at all. Why do men who love a beautiful wild bird feel sorry once they have caged it? When men destroy that which they love, they find it was not love after all but sin.



DreadPirateRandy -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/23/2008 10:18:25 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: terryjohn

I think it is true to say that sex is one thing and love is another.


I believe this to be a false statement.

Sex is the most intimate, close, personal act between husband and wife. It is the act that expresses your love for each other to the fullest. That is the intent design for it.

Sex, in and of itself, is not love. However, it is the most beautiful act to express the love you have for your spouse.



John_O -> RE: Respect and Sex (8/23/2008 11:00:11 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DreadPirateRandy

quote:

ORIGINAL: terryjohn

I think it is true to say that sex is one thing and love is another.


I believe this to be a false statement.

Sex is the most intimate, close, personal act between husband and wife. It is the act that expresses your love for each other to the fullest. That is the intent design for it.

Sex, in and of itself, is not love. However, it is the most beautiful act to express the love you have for your spouse.



Yes but people who do not love each other at all can still have sex.

Sex is merely a physical activity. One that can be saturated with the love of the participants (which I normally refer to as "making love") or one that can be absent of any emotional attachment whatsoever, the participants may not even know each others names (or care about each others names) for that matter (which I normally refer to as "having sex")

So, I agree with terryjohn. Sex is not love. Love is not sex.



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