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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 10/3/2008 2:45:52 PM
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crankius
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quote:
Crankius you ask who wrote it? Well let see you guys and gals have been on this repentence theme for quite awhile. Yet you keep forgetting the God is good and so to come to his side of the road. I would take it that you should try to make a effort to be good.
Please show direct quotes which state that repentance means we continue to act according to the sinful passions.
Please show direct quotes which state that "someone would talk about repenting and not do good."
Your accusations are hollow.
We are created in Christ Jesus FOR good works. However, one must first recognize their fallen state, repent, and have Christ as their Lord in order to be "in Christ Jesus."
Eph 2:10: "For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them."
_____________________________
Do not be overly righteous, Nor be overly wise: Why should you destroy yourself?
Ecclesiastes 7:16
SYSTEMATIC THEOLOGY
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 10/3/2008 2:45:55 PM
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mcleod
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quote:
You missed the entire point
What point is that I may ask?
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 10/3/2008 3:17:44 PM
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Roberta_
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mccleod-
Where did I ever say not to do good works? Where did I ever say not to be involved with others and in the community?
quote:
ORIGINAL: Kat_D
^^ Repentance and good works are two entirely different things. Some of the most sinful people in the world (think Hollywood) do good works.
Thank you Kat!
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 10/6/2008 6:41:50 PM
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dyluck
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quote:
I would take it that you should try to make a effort to be good.
Its not about effort to be good or effort to do good works. It is God that brings you to continious repentance. It is God that brings us to brokenness. It is God that gives us a heart of flesh so that we are open to him. It is God that changes you and give you his Holy Sprit in which, by nature, you are no longer sinful because of the Fruits of the spirit already apparent in you! That's why there is no "law" under which we must obey, but because of the spirit, we will obey automaticly. It doesn't mean we don't sin, it just means we are not sinful by nature. It isn't necissary to have a law in which would be transgressed by a creature that by nature no longer desires "pleasures" of sin. I quote pleasures because really they aren't pleasurable any more.
Read Galatians 5:13-26
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 10/7/2008 10:31:51 AM
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mcleod
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quote:
: dyluck
but because of the spirit, we will obey automaticly.
I am waiting where I am doing things right automaticly, but for some reason. Like Paul I wrestle with the battle everyday. 
quote:
dyluck:
it just means we are not sinful by nature.
Just as I wrote before if I wasn't having trouble in a area of sinning. Then it would be natural instinct to do that sin.
Just as you put down those passages from Galatians ch 5. You would note the writer says in the 13 verse "to induldge in the sinful nature." We have a distinct issues in which are shown if we are working in the flesh or in the Spirit of God.
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 10/7/2008 3:12:09 PM
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dyluck
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So are you currently working in the spirit or your fleshly desires? We have become dead to sin if we are Born from above...
Yes you wrestle with sin mcleod as you still have a body of flesh, but you tell me who will win?? God's Holy Spirit or your flesh???
I submit if your flesh wins, you don't have the holy spirit.
I submit that if you are truly in Christ, your nature will not be desire of sin, but desire for the things that are glorifying to God.
Your flesh will battle till you die, but when you sin (and we will sin), you will be broken over it and come to repentance.
This verse is not talking about sin, but living sinfully (full of sin, habitual sin, sin is your master, sin rules your life, sin that drives you, pleasures of sin).
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 10/8/2008 1:06:59 PM
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jazzact13
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quote:
but because of the spirit, we will obey automaticly
Can you show us, please, from the Bible, where it is written that we will automatically obey?
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 10/8/2008 8:10:21 PM
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crankius
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Doug Pagitt made this recent video discussing "the relationship of Emergent and Emergence with Emerging Church".
It's somewhat interesting--four minutes of emergent, emergence, and emergent church speak. 
At about 2.07, he refers to some talk of the emergent church reaching its end, and how he disagrees with this. He says it's not worth the conversation, because "emergence is happening...emergence in global engagement...and that's going to have implications...it's not going anywhere..."
He discusses a need for a network "inside of this great emergence taking place".
He doesn't think the Emergent Church is the center of it all, but is rather one of the enterprises of the larger concept of emergent theory.
He also mentions (about 50 sec into it) the "cultural shift" which has been happening for the last "500 years", as he says, "has ramifications in ecclesiastical structures."
EC theology is just sort of interesting to watch, as it sometimes seeks definition, and other times flees from any form of concrete definition.
_____________________________
Do not be overly righteous, Nor be overly wise: Why should you destroy yourself?
Ecclesiastes 7:16
SYSTEMATIC THEOLOGY
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 10/8/2008 8:27:08 PM
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Roberta_
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I agree crankius.
I have found members of the ECM to be more helpful than most other church members. I think that is awesome that you can almost always find someone in the ECM to give you a ride to church. However, it's not worth the sacrifice of Biblical truth. The ECM is right about teaching us to reach out to others. It's too bad that so much of their doctrine is wishy-washy.
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 10/8/2008 8:49:36 PM
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crankius
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I agree.
Service without the meat of the gospel, the truth of the genuine seed of the Word of God, is no better than any other worldly service organization.
On another note, there is an upcoming conference that should be interesting to observe.
quote:
The Great Emergence National Event is a unique and freshly designed event built on both innovative adult learning techniques including interaction and participation, and inspiring content on the current state of and future possibilities for Christianity.
Around the four main sessions with Phyllis Tickle, participants will also enjoy the daily office—thrice daily times of prayer—based on Phyllis Tickle’s bestselling book, The Divine Hours, in the majestic and historic Cathedral of St. Mary in Memphis, Tennessee, which will be bedecked with Advent greenery.
quote:
And there’s more! Workshops will be offered with some of the best practitioners of emergent Christianity, including Tim Keel, Peter Rollins, and Lisa and Will Samson.
Has anyone read the Phyllis Tickle book- Great Emergence, The: How Christianity is Changing and Why?
quote:
"The Great Emergence offers a sweeping overview of church history and locates us in a moment of great opportunity and challenge. To some, this analysis will come as a rude awakening, and to others, as a dream coming true. My hunch is that this will be one of the most important books of the year, and will shape the conversation among a wide range of Christians for years to come."--Brian McLaren, author/activist (brianmclaren.net)
quote:
"I cannot speak highly enough of this new book by Phyllis Tickle. Astonishing in its panoramic scope, cultural insight and lucid brevity, The Great Emergence pinpoints the global emerging church movement within the greater drama of Christianity in a new world. Finding her bearings from previous revolutions and locating our present upheaval within the rhythms of human history, Tickle shows us why The Great Emergence will not die away but will instead inaugurate and define the next epoch of Christianity. This book will raise eyebrows and expectations."--Andrew Jones, Mission Consultant, tallskinnykiwi.com
_____________________________
Do not be overly righteous, Nor be overly wise: Why should you destroy yourself?
Ecclesiastes 7:16
SYSTEMATIC THEOLOGY
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 10/10/2008 11:53:51 PM
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Rick4Him
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Hi All,
I just heard of an event that was held this week called the catalyst conference. Billy and Franklin Graham were supposed to have attended this Emergening event along with several Emerging leaders and the author of The Shack, I believe his name is William Young.
What in the world are Billy and Franklin doing?
Rick
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 10/13/2008 12:05:14 PM
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mcleod
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Rick4Him
Hi All,
I just heard of an event that was held this week called the catalyst conference. Billy and Franklin Graham were supposed to have attended this Emergening event along with several Emerging leaders and the author of The Shack, I believe his name is William Young.
What in the world are Billy and Franklin doing?
Rick
Say Rick maybe they aren't throwing baby out with the bath water. Somethings they talk about may have a sense of truth to it. But thats alright we are all perfect right now. Right? 
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 10/14/2008 11:56:16 AM
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colliefan
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quote:
I'm so tired of that argument...I worry about those who come up in the Emergent movement and don't know the difference between the baby in the bath water...how will they ever know which is which? Answer: They don't. They accept 100% of it as the baby!
My concern with what I know of the Emerging Church is they seem to ask the Serpent's question of "Did God really say...?"
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 10/14/2008 5:10:17 PM
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mcleod
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Kat
quote:
I'm so tired of that argument...I worry about those who come up in the Emergent movement and don't know the difference between the baby in the bath water...how will they ever know which is which? Answer: They don't. They accept 100% of it as the baby!
Say what if you get the big 64,000.00 question from the great throne that you missed some of Jesus Christ's teachings about how to live your life. Are you going to be the type, who is very arrogant and say back to him? What did I miss?.. I had all the answers all the time. You must be talking about those emergents. Who,me... you know Lord I wasn't one of them.
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 10/14/2008 5:15:47 PM
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JimboFletch
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quote:
ORIGINAL: mcleod
Say what if you get the big 64,000.00 question from the great throne that you missed some of Jesus Christ's teachings about how to live your life. Are you going to be the type, who is very arrogant and say back to him? What did I miss?.. I had all the answers all the time. You must be talking about those emergents. Who,me... you know Lord I wasn't one of them.
So, you think that God the Holy Spirit completely lost control of the redeemed everywhere from the time of the Apostle John's death until the time the emergents showed up to show us poor idiots the way back to the throne.
Sorry, I'm not sipping the emergent koolaid.
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 10/14/2008 5:20:43 PM
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earthless
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Did we ever get an answer from that poster about what is the mercy seat?
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 10/14/2008 5:23:27 PM
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crankius
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No, Earthless. He never did answer, and then he was deleted.
Here I posted the reason I was asking.
_____________________________
Do not be overly righteous, Nor be overly wise: Why should you destroy yourself?
Ecclesiastes 7:16
SYSTEMATIC THEOLOGY
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 10/14/2008 6:54:33 PM
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earthless
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quote:
ORIGINAL: crankius
No, Earthless. He never did answer, and then he was deleted.
What a shame. Lord knows he had more than enough time and opportunity to do so. And most of us know that he was purposely avoiding it.
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Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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so that they wouldn't be "deceived by empty words" (from Eph 5:6) or "tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness of deceitful plotting" (Eph 4:14b).
