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Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/20/2008 1:46:48 PM
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SeekingT
Posts: 13
Joined: 11/20/2008
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Hello everyone
I am so confused! I don't know what to do or who to ask.
I have been attending a church that believes that women ae not to wear pants because of what is says in Deuteronomy and how pants make women look masculine. For several years, being a baby Christian, I believed this as well. I believed that part of being born again, loving God, and sanctified was that women had to wear a dress or skirt. As I've grown, I've so many, many women who love God, who are born again and sanctified and they wear pants.
Long story short. I do not have a conviction about wering skirts/dresses. I did it because I thought it was a sign of being sanctified and your love for God. I now know that is not true. My confusion coms in the fact that I was told by amember that I could no longer be a member of the church I go to if I wear pants. . . .in or out of church. I'm looking for godly council, not mean spirited advice. These are still my brothers and sisters and I care for and love them deeply.
Thanks
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/20/2008 1:54:16 PM
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stellaluna
Posts: 4409
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Mmm...I probably would look for another church. I know that's easier said than done.
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/20/2008 1:59:30 PM
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doinkdom
Posts: 4319
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: The higher lowcountry
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Sounds you have an either/or decision to make.
What gives more glory to God?
Wearing only dresses and living in a works-based faith?
Wearing modest clothing and living in freedom that Jesus gave you?
One will leave you with friends, but a heavy heart towards God.
One will leave you with a joyful heart and maybe fewer friends.
It is a tough decision for anyone to make. I hope you find peace in whatever you decide.
_____________________________
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/20/2008 2:03:09 PM
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Liveloved
Posts: 2075
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My first suggestion would be for you to read the book of Colossians. It's short so won't take too long to read in entirety. Then reread chapter 2. Many get caught in these traps such as wearing skirts.
The Apostle Paul says "these are matters which have to be sure the appearance of wisdom in self-made religion and self-abasement and severe treatment of the body, but are of no value against fleshly indulgence. 2:23
OF NO VALUE could not be stronger. They make the one doing them feel wise, religious, perhaps closer to God but they are just an illusion and worthless. And, in fact, serve to deceive oneself.
Christ died to set you free. Read Galatians as well. That's another great book on the freedom Christ died to give you. Don't let others lead you back into bondage.
Love them. Pray for them. Speak loving truth to them. And move on. Bless you! 
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/20/2008 2:12:31 PM
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john_mark
Posts: 528
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what you should do depends on whether or not you want ot attend the church in question. i agree with you that their understanding is wrong in this matter. how important is this issue to you? as you encounter other christians you will find that they might not agree in all areas. some believe that only saturday worship is acceptable, some insist on a certain form of baptism, some might insist on certain gifts of the spirit, etc. because they hold such beliefs doesnt mean they are saved or lost.
wearing pants doesnt cause one to loose their salvation as you already know. but in the church you attend it is an important concept. if you attend wearing pants do you think it will be edifying for the congregation or will it cause division? sometimes you have to let your weaker brothers and sisters in Christ hold their beliefs and not cause them to stumble. please read 1 corinthians 8
think of how you can best love this congregation. if attending this church while wearing a dress is going to cause you to be angry, then find a place where you can worship and serve in love. if your love for this congregation is greater than your concerns about how one dresses, out of love, let them hold their beliefs, and in wisdom simply know that in this area they are different from your understanding.
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/20/2008 2:23:17 PM
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car2ner
Posts: 3031
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From: just north of Florida
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If they are a little off base about being judged by wearing pants, what else are they a little off base about? If were in your shoes think that I would go. Let your friends know that you love them dearly and will miss them but don't make a big deal out of why you are moving to another church.
Above all, make sure you move on God's timetable, which I admit, is easier said than done.
_____________________________
http://www.car2ner.2ya.com
"May your days be long and your hardships few".
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/20/2008 2:29:03 PM
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SeekingT
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Oh my goodness. Thank you to everyone for your kind and caring words.
This congregation is near and dear to my heart. Oh, I would never disrespct the congreation by coming into the church with pants on.
There is just no liberty to wear them anywhere else that concerns me. I don't want to be considered a non-member just because of not wearing a dress all the time. I've considered leaving but it seems like such a petty matter.
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/20/2008 2:32:04 PM
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zamdad
Posts: 1755
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Some churches major on the minors.
I attended a church like this years ago. I had long hair. They said I had to cut my hair and to wear a suit and tie. I began attending another church and found true brothers and sisters, not a bunch of legalistic do's and dont's.
_____________________________
The two hardest things to handle: failure and success.
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/20/2008 2:43:41 PM
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LCannon
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From: Lebanon, OR
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Colossians/Galatians 'brace'(pair)is our freedom to live in the liberty of obedience. Ask yourself, personally, why this new found freedom dawned on you. If indeed merely 'not wearing pants'(or any 'value added' quality)is a sign of penance, sanctification or 'credit' to one's salvation 'account' it seems(to me)a pretty low threshold. However as others commented, one has to decide whether his new found freedom is worth the upset in priorities and tradition just to make point or indulge to forge another tradition. You have now the freedom of obedience to accede to some doctrinal position and remain in the assembly or remove yourself.
_____________________________
"It may be that when the angels go about their task of praising God they play
only Bach. I am sure, however, that when they are together en famille they
play Mozart and then too our dear Lord listens with special pleasure."(Karl Barth)
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/20/2008 2:50:15 PM
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Qtman
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From: Crimson Tide Country
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SeekingT
Oh my goodness. Thank you to everyone for your kind and caring words.
This congregation is near and dear to my heart. Oh, I would never disrespct the congreation by coming into the church with pants on.
There is just no liberty to wear them anywhere else that concerns me. I don't want to be considered a non-member just because of not wearing a dress all the time. I've considered leaving but it seems like such a petty matter.
I was not going to respond tothis post because I felt it would mean more if the ladies did. But the bold part is what I have a real problem with. I don't really believe they should put those kind of requirements on you in the church but they have no right to do so outside the church. Like zamdad I have visited, although I think he said he attended, churches with certain beliefs. Clothes, hair, Bible version, dancing, alcohol, you name it. These beliefs have nothing to do with salvation and can actually act as a deterrent to Church growth. Once I lock on to these things I usually do not go back to that church. Also like zamdad pointed out you will probably never find a Church you totally 100% agree with. You have to find one that is the closest thing to what you believe. Also as someone else pointed out, I would quitely leave without a long explanation so as not to cause hard feelings.
_____________________________
STRESS = The internal struggle created when the brain trys to over ride the heart's desire to tell off some jerk that really deserves to be told off.
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/20/2008 3:16:22 PM
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doinkdom
Posts: 4319
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From: The higher lowcountry
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SeekingT
Guys, I have a DH and children. DH supports my decision either way, if I decide to stay or leave. He does not feel led to go, however. How can I stay where I do not feel liberty...do not feel freedom? How can I leave when my husbnd does not feel led to go?
Well, I would definitely have a serious conversation with my husband if he wanted to stay at a church that taught such extra-biblical ideas. I would ask his help to find biblical support for their position on this matter.
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/20/2008 3:24:30 PM
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doinkdom
Posts: 4319
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Qtman
quote:
ORIGINAL: doinkdom
quote:
ORIGINAL: SeekingT
Guys, I have a DH and children. DH supports my decision either way, if I decide to stay or leave. He does not feel led to go, however. How can I stay where I do not feel liberty...do not feel freedom? How can I leave when my husbnd does not feel led to go?
Well, I would definitely have a serious conversation with my husband if he wanted to stay at a church that taught such extra-biblical ideas. I would ask his help to find biblical support for their position on this matter.
Doink you and the rest will have to answer this part. I am afraid it is quite foreign to me. I would never stay in any situation in which my wife is not comfortable. I think probably her husband wouldn't either. Communicate communicate communicate.
Same here...and I'm hoping that once she has fully addressed this topic with her husband and how this truly affects her spiritual growth, he will definitely make the decision to leave.
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/20/2008 4:07:04 PM
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Jhud
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A couple of thoughts here, a few that might be different than what you heard thus far.
As far as I can tell thus far, the only problem you seem to have with this church is their 'pants policy'. You have said it's a very dear place to you - I assume by this you mean it's a place where you feel loved, where you feel you are recieving sound teaching (other than the pants thing), and where you feel you have a family of people who will encourage your growth in Christ.
The reality is, churches are much like human families - and always have been. They all have their personalities and problems, their flaws and shining moments of Christ likeness. As a believer who has been following Christ and watching other Christians for some twenty years, I have come to the conclusion that there is no church in exstence that some other group of believers won't find to be too conservative, or too liberal, or too traditional or too modern. The truth is, almost every church, including the one I have been involved with and commited to all my adult life, does something that doesn't make complete sense once in awhile.
So absent some obviously heretical teaching or abandonment of the central teachings of the gospel, you just need to ask yourself, just as if you were making a decision about any commited relationship you might have, do the problems you have with this church (so far you have mentioned only one) outweigh those things that you like about your church?
If not, then pick out some really nice dresses that will keep you warm in the winter, and cool in the summer.
_____________________________
Jack
I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else.
- C.S. Lewis
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/20/2008 7:54:05 PM
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1love1God1way
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Ned Flanders.
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love.ben
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/21/2008 11:13:05 AM
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Jhud
Posts: 7595
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From: Lake Wobegon
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quote:
Well, it's easy for hubby, he gets to wear what he wants.
Just a guess, but I am willing to guess her church might bristle if hubby wore a skirt.
< Message edited by Jhud -- 11/21/2008 12:22:07 PM >
_____________________________
Jack
I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else.
- C.S. Lewis
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/21/2008 12:23:22 PM
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redeemedsaint
Posts: 496
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Look for another church.
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Woody
Get off the track cause the freight train is coming - Coach Bobby Lee Duke from Facing the Giants
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/21/2008 2:24:06 PM
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SeekingT
Posts: 13
Joined: 11/20/2008
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quote:
If they are a little off base about being judged by wearing pants, what else are they a little off base about? If were in your shoes think that I would go. Let your friends know that you love them dearly and will miss them but don't make a big deal out of why you are moving to another church.
Above all, make sure you move on God's timetable, which I admit, is easier said than done.
Their are other things that lend themself to be off base.
They believe that women(or men, that's for Jhud  ) should not wear makeup, necklaces or earrings as well. I mean that's the regulations that have been set for the membership of this particular church. If the members desire to abide by this fine. Just don't look down on others who do.
This is the expected standard. If you don't adhere to the standard in or out of the church building you are not considered a member, but a visitor. How can this be when we all are part of the body of Christ? I believe if I make the decision to go, I should be able to come back and "visit" and be welcomed and received as someone who is still part of the body of Jesus Christ, who is still part of His Church (although I may no longer be a member of their local church).
I don't know where to go. I'm not looking forward to looking for another local church. Guys, I really feel tied to this assembly.
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/21/2008 2:29:49 PM
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SeekingT
Posts: 13
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Isn't there a higher standard that none of us can reach?
That's why God sent his son Jesus to die on the cross for our sins.
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/21/2008 2:44:08 PM
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Liveloved
Posts: 2075
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SeekingT
Guys, I have a DH and children. DH supports my decision either way, if I decide to stay or leave. He does not feel led to go, however. How can I stay where I do not feel liberty...do not feel freedom? How can I leave when my husbnd does not feel led to go?
SeekingT,
I hope you have read Colossians & Galatians to remind yourself of the freedom we have in Christ. You are free, dear one.
However, you are also bound to your husband---a bond you have chosen. If your husband is not led to leave this body of believers, I would say stay and pray. You can pray for this particular body of believers. And you can pray for your husband.
Freedom means the right to choose. And we choose bondage to Christ and we can also choose bondage to men. That is what freedom allows. Jesus allowed other men to kill Him. He did not fight. He did not leave. Or look at Judas. Jesus knew Judas' heart. He knew that Judas would betray Him. Yet Jesus remained and allowed Judas to be Judas. It is a hard choice but I believe it is very much a Jesus choice.
I think it is important that married couples worship together. I think you need to remain WITH your husband as long as he is comfortable in that body and God has not placed on his heart the leaving. God may have bigger plans for this body, your husband, yourself or your children. We only see and know a small part. God sees and orchestrates the whole.
It sounds like this is a loving assembly. If wearing a skirt is honoring to them, you will be showing them love. You can do it truthfully. You can do it in freedom. It is a choice you are making for love. It is laying down your rights. It is Jesus' way.
Bless you as you make your decision, LL
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/21/2008 2:51:47 PM
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phreddy
Posts: 287
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Jhud
quote:
Well, it's easy for hubby, he gets to wear what he wants.
Just a guess, but I am willing to guess her church might bristle if hubby wore a skirt.
My old church annually had their "kirken of the tartans" when men could wear kilts in thelr family tartan plaid. Of course they would not approve someone calling them skirts.
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RE: Please Help, I don't know what to do? - 11/21/2008 2:55:35 PM
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SeekingT
Posts: 13
Joined: 11/20/2008
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Thanks for your post Liveloved.
I had tears in my eyes as I read your post. Whatever the decision, it's not going to be an easy one. I'm torn.
thanks to everyone. I'm so glad this forum is here. You guys and gals are the best.
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