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Now that Obama is President... - 7/30/2008 10:53:38 AM
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Jhud
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I just wanted to get reaction from some folks now that the election is over and Obama has won. What? The election hasn't occurred yet? Someone needs to inform Obama - from the insightful (and funny) column by Dana Milbank of WaPO: President Obama Continues Hectic Victory Tour Barack Obama has long been his party's presumptive nominee. Now he's becoming its presumptuous nominee. Fresh from his presidential-style world tour, during which foreign leaders and American generals lined up to show him affection, Obama settled down to some presidential-style business in Washington yesterday. He ordered up a teleconference with the (current president's) Treasury secretary, granted an audience to the Pakistani prime minister and had his staff arrange for the chairman of the Federal Reserve to give him a briefing. Then, he went up to Capitol Hill to be adored by House Democrats in a presidential-style pep rally. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The 5:20 TBA turned out to be his adoration session with lawmakers in the Cannon Caucus Room, where even committee chairmen arrived early, as if for the State of the Union. Capitol Police cleared the halls -- just as they do for the actual president. The Secret Service hustled him in through a side door -- just as they do for the actual president. Inside, according to a witness, he told the House members, "This is the moment . . . that the world is waiting for," adding: "I have become a symbol of the possibility of America returning to our best traditions." As he marches toward Inauguration Day (Election Day is but a milestone on that path), Obama's biggest challenger may not be Republican John McCain but rather his own hubris. Some say the supremely confident Obama -- nearly 100 days from the election, he pronounces that "the odds of us winning are very good" -- has become a president-in-waiting. But in truth, he doesn't need to wait: He has already amassed the trappings of the office, without those pesky decisions. The Atlantic's Marc Ambinder reported last week that Obama has directed his staff to begin planning for his transition to the White House, causing Republicans to howl about premature drape measuring. Obama was even feeling confident enough to give British Prime Minister Gordon Brown some management advice over the weekend. "If what you're trying to do is micromanage and solve everything, then you end up being a dilettante," he advised the prime minister, portraying his relative inexperience much as President Bush did in 2000. -------------------------------------------------------------- It had been a long day of acting presidential, but Obama wasn't done. After a few hours huddling with advisers over his vice presidential choice, Obama made his way to the pep rally on the Hill. Moments after he entered the meeting with lawmakers, there was an extended cheer, followed by another, and another. "I think this can be an incredible election," Obama said later. "I look forward to collaborating with everybody here to win the election." Win the election? Didn't he do that already? Beside his own presumptuousness, I think Obama faces one other obstacle, one more typical of celebrities than politicians (which is apropos considering his rock star style campaign) - that obstacle would be over-exposure. It may be that by the time the election actually arrives, we may be tired of him as President.
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Jack I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else. - C.S. Lewis
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 7/30/2008 11:20:37 AM
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lightshineon
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It is Bo, and Michelle, and their arrogance, because they are playing mind games making everyone think it is already so. Our minds are so easy to trick, with the media, this canidates and his dominate wifes arrogance, plus his Middle East visits, acting like he is already president. I do not see them taking no, you did not win as an option. They are using mind tactics, and many cannot see that. Shameful that many can not see, he is duping the American people. He and his wife are two of the most arrogant people I believe I have seen. I have seen arrogance even on these threads, but this just takes the cake. Read some of his, and his wifes former quotes. They do not say if Obama, becomes president it is always stated as when.So much for a smidgen of humility, not finding it in the Obama camp at all.
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Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them. F.T., 2007 Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 7/30/2008 12:06:18 PM
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SuspenseWriter
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It was an interesting election, wasn't it? And he can thank the liberal, tax-loving, gay-marriage-affirming, abortion-adoring "Christians" who placed him there. The rest of us will pay the freight, of course, but that's okay. The BOssiah has arrived! Let all the nations of the earth rejoice!
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John Robinson writer of suspense...obviously! www.johnrobinsonbooks.com http://www.johnrobinsonbooks.com/my-journal/
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 7/30/2008 12:08:31 PM
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inthysite
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Well NObama may think he is president, the Dems may act like he is president, but the polls tell a completely different story. He had a small bump in the polls after his magical mystery tour but that soon dropped. He has never had more than an 6 point lead over McCain and hasn't gone over 50% in the polls. When you add in other factors the race is a lot closer than people think. I think NObama is in for a big disappointment.
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Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart Be acceptable in Thy sight, O LORD, my rock and my Redeemer - Psalm 19:14
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 7/30/2008 1:03:16 PM
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Rufas2000
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Fun article. I'm not going to dispute the idea that Senator Obama thinks highly of himself (and really, doesn't anyone who runs for president?) but just to play the other side for a second: Yes he did act presidential on his "magical mystery tour" but that was the point. There was a couple of presumptuous moments (like when he wanted to speak at a place where only sitting presidents had spoke) but mostly this was a trip designed to show Americans that Obama as president could act "presidential" overseas. It was a "preview" if you will and its good campaign strategy. It played up to Obama's strengths as a good looking, charasmatic guy who leaves a good impression. It doesn't expose Obama's weaknesses like inexperience* and a lack of specifics in his campaign message. As far as saying when I win as opposed to if, I think all candadates running for president believe they are going to win (including Senator McCain). What would be the point in running for president if you don't believe you'll win? Obama simply is being more upfront about it. It's part of that carefully cultivated image and I don't think its meant to be disrespectful to McCain or any other potential opponent. Planning fo the transition to the White House: considering at the moment he is one of only two possible people who will occupy the White House in January it makes good sense to plan for it now. I hope McCain is doing the same thing. Two months isn't enough time to get everything in order. The Secret Service hustling him in: they need to be real careful with Obama. Being African American, some racist nutball may attempt to assasinate him. In addition to the normal assortment of nutballs that will attempt to assasinate either presidential candidate. quote:
Beside his own presumptuousness, I think Obama faces one other obstacle, one more typical of celebrities than politicians (which is apropos considering his rock star style campaign) - that obstacle would be over-exposure. It may be that by the time the election actually arrives, we may be tired of him as President. The best point of the whole post. People tend to rebel against things that are over hyped and tend to get weary of PR machines cranked up to maximum. This is a very big danger to Obama. quote:
He has never had more than an 6 point lead over McCain and hasn't gone over 50% in the polls. I just heard on Fox News last night that two polls were taken, one where Obama had an 8 point lead and another where McCain had a 4 point lead. So when you say never more than a 6 point lead are you referring to a certain poll or perhaps a daily composite of various or all polls? However, it is obvious that you are right, the race is too close to call right now. I also think that Obama being black increases his poll numbers because people fear being labeled racist. Also, polls don't count. Its easy to say I'll vote for the shiny exciting new guy when it doesn't count but when it comes to actually casting the vote people may get cold feet and go with the perceived more steady option of McCain. In essence, there is no reason to think Obama will outperform his poll numbers and every reason to think he'll underperform in comparison to them. * I can see some of you typing now that George W Bush was inexperienced or whatever. While that may be true it does not negate the fact that Obama is inexperienced. Inexperience is always a weakness. It does not mean that Obama (or anyone else) doesn't possess strengths to counteract it but its still a weakness. It also does not mean that the one with more experience is the best choice, they may have faults that cancel the experience out. But all things being equal, experience is better than a lack of experience.
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 7/30/2008 1:04:31 PM
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cow451
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Career counselors always suggest you dress for the job you want, not the one you have. Can't fault him for running a good campaign so far. But anything that happens before Labor Day is unlikely to have much impact in the voting booth. The popularity polls are basically even. It's the Electoral College that counts and Obummer is better situated at this point per Rassmussen LINK The Rasmussen Reports Balance of Power Calculator currently shows now Obama leading in states with 210 Electoral College votes while McCain leads in states with 165 votes. When leaners are included, it’s Obama 273, McCain 227. Rasmussen Markets data gives Obama a 61.9% chance of winning the White House.
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Nobody ever heard of Acid Rain before we sent people into space.
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My mistake - 7/30/2008 4:15:51 PM
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Evangel70
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Posting as new thread
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May the God who gives endurance and encouragement give you a spirit of unity among yourselves as you follow Christ Jesus, so that with one heart and mouth you may glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.
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RE: My mistake - 7/30/2008 6:49:37 PM
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jkdjr25
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You have heard of using creative language right? Maybe the author used the words he did because Obama was acting, oh I don't know, Presidential? That is within the realm of possibility you know, whether you like it or not.
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I reject your reality and subsitute my own.- Adam Savage, Mythbusters
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RE: My mistake - 7/30/2008 6:53:40 PM
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Jhud
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quote:
You have heard of using creative language right? Maybe the author used the words he did because Obama was acting, oh I don't know, Presidential? That is within the realm of possibility you know, whether you like it or not. Actually, I think it's fairly clear the author was being satirical.
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Jack I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else. - C.S. Lewis
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 7/30/2008 8:06:43 PM
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todd_t
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quote:
Beside his own presumptuousness, I think Obama faces one other obstacle, one more typical of celebrities than politicians (which is apropos considering his rock star style campaign) - that obstacle would be over-exposure. It may be that by the time the election actually arrives, we may be tired of him as President. I agree that Obama is suffering from overexposure. I think a lot of it has to do with his historical presence, plus the fact that McCain hardly sets the world on fire in terms of public speaking. As for the Milbank piece, I found it dishonest (for example) with the following snippet: Inside, according to a witness, he told the House members, "This is the moment . . . that the world is waiting for," adding: "I have become a symbol of the possibility of America returning to our best traditions." Pretty arrogant, huh? Now real the whole quote: "It has become increasingly clear in my travel, the campaign -- that the crowds, the enthusiasm, 200,000 people in Berlin, is not about me at all. It's about America. I have just become a symbol." A bit different in its original form, isn't it? But of course, it's an election year and the RNC wants to put the most unflattering scope on Obama as possible. Does that mean he is above reproach? No, but at least get your facts straight (Mr. Milbank).
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In Memoriam: 1st Sgt. Obediah Kolath, US Army, Died in Iraq War (1973-2005)
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 7/30/2008 8:31:49 PM
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Jhud
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quote:
"It has become increasingly clear in my travel, the campaign -- that the crowds, the enthusiasm, 200,000 people in Berlin, is not about me at all. It's about America. I have just become a symbol." A bit different in its original form, isn't it? But of course, it's an election year and the RNC wants to put the most unflattering scope on Obama as possible. Does that mean he is above reproach? No, but at least get your facts straight (Mr. Milbank). Actually todd, you seem to be quoting a staffer's version of what Obama said, after this piece came out. While it may be a legitimate case of 'he said/ she said" I don't think you can rightly say that Milbank didn't get his facts straight - nor that Milbank is in any way shape or form acting on behest of the RNC - those would be the facts.
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Jack I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else. - C.S. Lewis
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 7/31/2008 2:10:12 AM
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saved9201
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So from now on, a candidate should be corrected when they say, "When i become president of the United States...", they should say, "If I become President of the United States...." Perhaps there should be limits imposed on crowds? Prohibitions on cheering too much for one and not for another? Forcing Obama to share some of his crowds with McCain? Don't worry folks. Relax. Just ask yourself this question: how many of the screaming mob that Obama draws will actually vote for him? - Julius
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 7/31/2008 12:16:04 PM
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Jhud
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quote:
Don't worry folks. Relax. Just ask yourself this question: how many of the screaming mob that Obama draws will actually vote for him? Well, considering they were mostly Germans, I don't think any of them were allowed to vote for him.
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Jack I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else. - C.S. Lewis
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 7/31/2008 12:34:01 PM
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Evangel70
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quote:
Well, considering they were mostly Germans, I don't think any of them were allowed to vote for him. Makes one wonder how many of those Germans voted for Regan when he was getting the same kind of response on his "tear down the wall" tour.
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May the God who gives endurance and encouragement give you a spirit of unity among yourselves as you follow Christ Jesus, so that with one heart and mouth you may glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 7/31/2008 12:40:46 PM
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Jhud
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quote:
Makes one wonder how many of those Germans voted for Regan when he was getting the same kind of response on his "tear down the wall" tour. Well, again, as they weren't American citizens, none of them did. And Reagan was not particularly popular in Europe.
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Jack I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else. - C.S. Lewis
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 7/31/2008 1:21:56 PM
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SuspenseWriter
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Jack, you might as well save your breath, man. For some reason a disheartening number of "Christians' have hitched their wagon to this abortion-loving, tax-raising, gay-marriage-affirming yahoo. Their hearts have been hardened, and nothing will get through. We just have to take solace in that fact that none of this is taking God by surprise, and He's going to get the glory, regardless.
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John Robinson writer of suspense...obviously! www.johnrobinsonbooks.com http://www.johnrobinsonbooks.com/my-journal/
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 7/31/2008 1:36:48 PM
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jkdjr25
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SuspenseWriter Jack, you might as well save your breath, man. For some reason a disheartening number of "Christians' have hitched their wagon to this abortion-loving, tax-raising, gay-marriage-affirming yahoo. Their hearts have been hardened, and nothing will get through. We just have to take solace in that fact that none of this is taking God by surprise, and He's going to get the glory, regardless. Just like many "Christians" have hitched their wagons to the lying, deceitful, anti-poor, flip-flop-flipper the republicans are running. Their hearts have been hardened and nothing will get through. Republicans are just as bad as Democrats, just in different ways.
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I reject your reality and subsitute my own.- Adam Savage, Mythbusters
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 7/31/2008 1:41:07 PM
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Jhud
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quote:
Just like many "Christians" have hitched their wagons to the lying, deceitful, anti-poor, flip-flop-flipper the republicans are running. Their hearts have been hardened and nothing will get through. Republicans are just as bad as Democrats, just in different ways. Our form of government assumes a universal sin nature - which is a good (and safe) assumption by the way. The danger comes when we assume someone has risen above it.
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Jack I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else. - C.S. Lewis
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 7/31/2008 2:59:26 PM
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Jhud
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quote:
Perhaps there should be limits imposed on crowds? Prohibitions on cheering too much for one and not for another? Forcing Obama to share some of his crowds with McCain? Don't worry folks. Relax. Just ask yourself this question: how many of the screaming mob that Obama draws will actually vote for him? You know Julius, having observed a number of your posts on the subject, I am beginning to think you have a one sided (though important) view of this election, and are actually blind to another very important consideration that is perhaps equally, if not a greater factor here. The factor I am thinking about is actually borrowed from Spike Lee. It’s a term he used to describe the role blacks frequently play in American fiction. I will modify the term a bit because the original wording might be offensive to some, but it’s called the Myth of the Magic Black Man. Unlike one stereotype some whites have of blacks (gangstas, welfare queens, angry victims, etc.) this depiction is a positive one – it views certain black people as mystically wise, capable of helping others overcome there own weaknesses and troubles, and enlightening them in such a way so as to direct them into a better life. Frequently such characters seem to have mysterious origins, with no earthly ties, and exist primarily to help a particular person or group of people (usually white). We are familiar with such figures in fiction, like Will Smith’s character in Bagger Vance, Morpheus in The Matrix, and, well, virtually every character Morgan Freeman ever played. And we have real life examples too. Oprah, though not a man, is very much like this – even though she has no particular education in any of the subjects she talks about, has never personally been married, or had a child, she nonetheless dispenses wisdom about all these things, showers her audience with gifts from her great wealth, and shares secrets that are supposed to give us success in this life. I think we see the same phenomena in Obama – he is enough of a blank slate that we can project our hopes and wishes on him. We don’t care about his experience because he has ‘good judgment’. He has swooped in from seemingly nowhere to give us hope and change our lives and lead us down the right path. He is magical. And interestingly the reason white folks do this is two-fold. The first is that blacks are enough of a mystery to many of us that we can imagine that they somehow have something we don’t; we often do the same things with Asians and Native Americans as well – we perceive them as somehow closer to the earth, more in tune with the wisdom of nature, able to give us insights beyond simple forms of knowledge. The second reason is less pleasant – in this role blacks and others are still subservient – they were sent to us, to help us, they exist so that we might benefit, and would have no other purpose otherwise. When they have helped us, their job is to slip off into the twilight. So I see two things at play here, one which might hurt Obama’s aspirations, one which might help him. And ironically in all this McCain really plays no role – we have summed him up, and he has no power against this mythology. On one hand there are the usual small group ignorant folks who want to ascribe to Obama some nefarious purpose, an evil they might not ever see in a white man who held the same views. And on the other hand, and I think there is a much larger group that sees him in this magical light. Of course you have a lot of other folks in the middle, including some black folks who support him primarily because ’it’s time’, and other who think more critically about it. The thing that concerns me is that neither view sees Obama as he needs to be seen – as a man in his own right, with all the strengths and weaknesses of any man, with ideas that may or may not help our country. What is not clear to me is whether or not Obama wants to be seen this way, and if he doesn’t, then I think we are all in for some big disappointments, because once he assumes office, he will never be able to live up to the image that has either been projected upon him, or has been cultivated by him or his supporters. So I guess my take on this is that you are seeing something fairly narrowly which has much broader implications. Thoughts?
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Jack I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else. - C.S. Lewis
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 7/31/2008 9:59:39 PM
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saved9201
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Jhud ...it’s called the Myth of the Magic Black Man. Unlike one stereotype some whites have of blacks (gangstas, welfare queens, angry victims, etc.) this depiction is a positive one – it views certain black people as mystically wise, capable of helping others overcome there own weaknesses and troubles, and enlightening them in such a way so as to direct them into a better life. Frequently such characters seem to have mysterious origins, with no earthly ties, and exist primarily to help a particular person or group of people (usually white). We are familiar with such figures in fiction, like Will Smith’s character in Bagger Vance, Morpheus in The Matrix, and, well, virtually every character Morgan Freeman ever played. And we have real life examples too. Oprah.... I did a little looking in to this and it's an interesting take. The role of the "magic negro" is primarily cinematic as you point out, and I might add Michael Clarke Duncan, John Coffey from "The Green Mile" as one of the most magical of all time. So yes, there may be some who do look at Obama in this light. Then there's another figure called the "acceptable negro" This guy is palatable to the American majority. Essentially he doesn’t make people too uncomfortable when they think about America’s sordid racial past. On the surface, Obama fits that bill: good-looking, well-spoken and non-violent. Here's the problem with both those models: We can accept the magical negro in cinematic roles and as entertainers. We can accept the "acceptable negro" as buddies and as neighbors and even as bosses. But as President of the United States? Once you cross that line they lose their magicability and they become less acceptable. Both magical and acceptable negros normally have one trait in common: they're both humble. When you campaign for POTUS, you HAVE to throw your humble card out the window. In other words, thats not a "role" a lot of folks can see Obama in. McCain aired two recent ads. In the first ad, he criticized Obama for not going to see the wounded troops in Germany, and showed Obama playing basketball. In the second ad, he compares Obama to entertainers Britney Spears and Paris Hilton. The hook reads, "But can he lead?" Athlete? We can picture that. Entertainer? Sure. President? Sorry. Magical/Acceptable negroes don't do president. quote:
The thing that concerns me is that neither view sees Obama as he needs to be seen – as a man in his own right, with all the strengths and weaknesses of any man, with ideas that may or may not help our country. What is not clear to me is whether or not Obama wants to be seen this way, and if he doesn’t, then I think we are all in for some big disappointments, because once he assumes office, he will never be able to live up to the image that has either been projected upon him, or has been cultivated by him or his supporters. So I guess my take on this is that you are seeing something fairly narrowly which has much broader implications. Thoughts? What I see is, plain and simple, that the majority of voting Americans aren't ready for a black president. They may be ready for a black president who has no intention of running for president, i.e. Colin Powell, Condolezza Rice, J.C. Watts, etc., but not Obama. Now, I am by no means saying that everybody who opposes Obama does so because he's black. There are those diehard conservatives who weren't going to vote for ANY democrat based on their oppositon to the democratic party platform. Add to that those I just mentioned who may like him but simply can't accept him in the "role" of president, those ignorant people who think he's a Muslim or that he's inherently evil, those disgruntled Hillary supporters and those who may disagree with him on one or two issues key to them, and I see more that will eventually lean against him than for him. In other words, I smell a McCain landslide. - Julius
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 7/31/2008 10:48:26 PM
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todd_t
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quote:
In other words, I smell a McCain landslide. I'm not so sure.
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 8/1/2008 12:25:46 AM
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wing2000
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Interesting observations...just when I was ready to ignore the Politics folder. Thanks for sharing. quote:
So I see two things at play here, one which might hurt Obama’s aspirations, one which might help him. And ironically in all this McCain really plays no role – we have summed him up, and he has no power against this mythology. On one hand there are the usual small group ignorant folks who want to ascribe to Obama some nefarious purpose, an evil they might not ever see in a white man who held the same views. And on the other hand, and I think there is a much larger group that sees him in this magical light.
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 8/1/2008 12:42:01 AM
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cow451
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quote:
ORIGINAL: saved9201 What I see is, plain and simple, that the majority of voting Americans aren't ready for a black president. They may be ready for a black president who has no intention of running for president, i.e. Colin Powell, Condolezza Rice, J.C. Watts, etc., but not Obama. Now, I am by no means saying that everybody who opposes Obama does so because he's black. There are those diehard conservatives who weren't going to vote for ANY democrat based on their oppositon to the democratic party platform. Add to that those I just mentioned who may like him but simply can't accept him in the "role" of president, those ignorant people who think he's a Muslim or that he's inherently evil, those disgruntled Hillary supporters and those who may disagree with him on one or two issues key to them, and I see more that will eventually lean against him than for him. In other words, I smell a McCain landslide. - Julius First, let me acknowledge are thoughtful exchange between two intelligent people-- that hold some opposing views-- about the election. This is all too rare. That said, I think most voters are more ready than you think. He is bi-racial. If you notice popular culture, many people are drawn to bi-racial celebrities who self-identify as black: Tiger Woods, Halle Berry, Mariah Carey, Soledad Obrien, Derek Jeter. Perhaps, these people are perceived as "safer" by whites. At any rate, just a thought.
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Nobody ever heard of Acid Rain before we sent people into space.
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RE: Now that Obama is President... - 8/1/2008 6:06:22 AM
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saved9201
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451 That said, I think most voters are more ready than you think. He is bi-racial. If you notice popular culture, many people are drawn to bi-racial celebrities who self-identify as black: Tiger Woods, Halle Berry, Mariah Carey, Soledad Obrien, Derek Jeter. Perhaps, these people are perceived as "safer" by whites. At any rate, just a thought. What do all the people you mentioned have in common? All are athletes or entertainers. Again note the latest two McCain ads: Obama playing basketball and Obama as Paris Hilton and Britney Spears. The message?Obama is an athlete and an entertainer, both perfectly acceptable roles, but not president. Why did he actually drop in the polls after having his European tour? I think there are people who saw him looking "presidential" and felt uneasy. Then he came back and started "measuring the drapes" so to speak, for the white house. He's getting too close. There are fans of his who will continue to drop out as they file out of the theater as the credits roll. "Okay, that was a great movie, but now it's over and we have to elect a REAL president. So line up the white guys and lets get this over with." Again, I don't think this is racist because there are going to be blacks with the same attitude. Some people have simply become conditioned to accepting certain people in certain roles and Obama or someone who looks like him as President of the United States isn't one they're ready for yet. - Julius
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