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Non OSAS Security Beliefs - 9/15/2008 9:03:49 PM
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drfuss
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The purpose if this thread is to list and discuss the security of the believer beliefs that do not accept eternal security.
There was another thread on here that discussed various eternal security beliefs that assumed eternal security was correct.
This thread assumes eternal security is not correct. While comments are welcome from all, eternal security Christians are requested to refrain from providing comments that tend to lead to an eternal security debate, such as comments, testimonies or scriptures that are interpreted to support eternal security.
I know of four groups of security beliefs that do not accept eternal security. Each group has listed an example of the denominations that hold to that belief. Including sample denomination assists in identifying the belief. Since becoming a Christian, I have not attended any of the sample denominations, so help me out if necessary.
1. Reformed Arminian I - A Christian can forfeit his salvation by deciding to stop believing in Christ as Savior (Apostasy). Having done so, he cannot again trust in Christ as Savior. Works are not involved in retaining salvation. [Free-Will Baptist].
2. Reformed Arminian II - - A Christian can forfeit his salvation by deciding to stop believing in Christ as Savior (Apostasy). Having done so, he can repent and continue trusting Christ as before. Works are not involved in retaining salvation. [Lutheran].
3. Wesleyan Arminian - In addition to Belief #2 above, A Christian should confess, repent and be remorseful for known sins to ensure retention of his salvation. [United Methodist].
4. Catholic - In addition to Belief #2 above, some works must be provided for God’s free grace to be applied. [Roman Catholic].
In addition to constructive comments and corrections, I am interested in how the following denominations relate to the above belief groups: Seventh Day Adventist, Holiness Churches, Christian Missionary Alliance, etc.
Please provide any additional groups of security beliefs, But keep each belief description to three sentences of less to keep it manageable.
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RE: Non OSAS Security Beliefs - 9/15/2008 10:26:52 PM
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lw9
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Hello drfuss:
I can't speak for every Lutheran denomination, but the LCMS [Lutheran Church Missouri Synod] rejects OSAS.
Edit: Oops... i just noticed you listed Lutheran above. :-)
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RE: Non OSAS Security Beliefs - 9/16/2008 9:25:54 AM
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JimboFletch
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quote:
1. Reformed Arminian I - A Christian can forfeit his salvation by deciding to stop believing in Christ as Savior (Apostasy). Having done so, he cannot again trust in Christ as Savior. Works are not involved in retaining salvation. [Free-Will Baptist].
As a former FWB, I can assert that the above isn't entirely correct. Most FWB believe you can be saved, lost, and saved repeatedly. Furthermore, they may not claim that works are involved in retaining salvation, but they have an almost endless and ever-changing list of activities (even attire) that are indications of one's continued salvation - so works are in reality the means of keeping salvation.
That, and the effects of such a system, are why I left the FWB after 34 years.
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RE: Non OSAS Security Beliefs - 9/16/2008 10:31:03 AM
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drfuss
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Drfuss: Jumbo, I have a friend who had the same experience when he attended a FWB church years ago. It was the FWB that I had in mind in the OP when I said some ministers have strayed from their denominations beliefs.
I got the Reformed Arminian I view and Wesleyan Arminian view from a book entitled “4 Views on Eternal Security” published by Zondervan. In the book, four theology professors present their views and comment on the other three views. The four views are:
1. Classical Calvinism View (5 Points) - Dr. Michael S Horton, Westminster Theological Seminary, Escondido, Calif.
2. Moderate Calvinist View (Eternal Security) - Dr. Norman Geisler, Southern Evangelical Seminary, Charlotte, N.C.
3. Reformed Arminian - Dr. Stephen Ashby (FWB), Ball State University, Muncie, Ind.
4. Wesleyan Arminian - Dr Steve Harper, Asbury Theological Seminary, Orlando Fla.
The Lutheran View came from a Lutheran Website, and the Roman Catholic View from a debate on TV concerning the importance of faith and works between a Roman Catholic Priest and a Baptist minister.
< Message edited by drfuss -- 9/16/2008 12:13:19 PM >
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RE: Non OSAS Security Beliefs - 9/16/2008 11:19:30 AM
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JimboFletch
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Drfuss, although I never heard of Dr. Stephen Ashby during my years in the FWB and an ardent student of the FWB doctrines, I will accept your endorsement that he knows more than I do on the real beliefs of the FWB in Muncie, Ind.
But, FWIW, from the national headquarters in Nashville (and the FWB college) southward, it was a different story from the 50s through the mid 80s when I was a member.
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RE: Non OSAS Security Beliefs - 9/16/2008 1:13:06 PM
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Ps103
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