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New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/16/2008 9:12:02 PM
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todd_t
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From: The North Woods
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I'll be the first to admit (as one of his supporters) that most of Obama's TV ads have been anemic, and relatively punchless.
I think this latest one, however, is the exception via using McCain's own misguided words against him on the economy:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6reQLzgywzk
_____________________________
In Memoriam: 1st Sgt. Obediah Kolath, US Army, Died in Iraq War (1973-2005)
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/16/2008 10:53:40 PM
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inthysite
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Actually truth be told the fundamentals of the economy are strong. Obama is relying on fear and ignorance.
The ad may be effective seeing how the liberals have convinced everyone that the sky is falling. The subprime housing crises added with the recent bankruptcies and bailouts on Wall Street, all due to greed and corruption and not the economy, have people frantic and buying into the liberals deception.
But if you look at the actual numbers the economy isn't as bad as they paint it out to be.
This article has been discussed in another thread but I feel it's important to reference it again.
Bush Has a Good Economic Record
The IMF reports that real U.S. gross domestic product (GDP) grew at an average annual rate of 2.2% over the period 2001-2008 (including its forecast for the current year). President Bush will leave to his successor an economy 19% larger than the one he inherited from President Clinton.
The U.S. employment rate, measured by the percentage of people of working age (16-65 years) in jobs, has remained high by international standards. The latest OECD figures show a rate of 71.7% in 2006. This was more than five percentage points above the average for the euro area.
The U.S. unemployment rate averaged 4.7% from 2001-2007. This compares with a 5.2% average rate during President Clinton's term of office, and is well below the euro zone average of 8.3% since 2000.
The IMF reports that the interest cost of servicing general government debt in the U.S. has averaged 2.0% of GDP annually from 2001-2008, compared with 2.7% in the euro zone. It averaged 3.2% annually when President Clinton was in office.
The cost of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan has been largely absorbed in a relatively small increase in the defense budget (to 4.1% of GDP in 2006 from 3.8% in 1995). A much higher proportion of U.S. income was devoted to the military during World War II and the Korean War.
And lets not forget that the price of oil has dropped below $100 a barrel and once the refineries reopen in the Gulf gas prices will drop as well, energy costs should be cheaper by this winter.
_____________________________
Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart
Be acceptable in Thy sight, O LORD, my rock and my Redeemer - Psalm 19:14
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/16/2008 11:18:32 PM
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todd_t
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quote:
Actually truth be told the fundamentals of the economy are strong.
In what universe? Unemployment is at a five-year high, and the Wall Street lending industry is coming apart at the seams.
_____________________________
In Memoriam: 1st Sgt. Obediah Kolath, US Army, Died in Iraq War (1973-2005)
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 6:19:20 AM
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csl7037
Posts: 1623
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quote:
ORIGINAL: inthysite
Actually truth be told the fundamentals of the economy are strong. Obama is relying on fear and ignorance.
McCain's just out there saying that we're not that far gone that we can't turn this around relatively quickly. It's optimism v. pessimism. I simply cannot stand to listen to Obama complain and talk down America.
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 9:25:06 AM
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Psalms274
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quote:
Unemployment is at a five-year high, and the Wall Street lending industry is coming apart at the seams.
The government does not "create" jobs ... people who own businesses do. The President has very little to do with the unemployment numbers except for (through tax proposals) keeping the client favorable for business to insure they can keep their money and invest it into growing their business (and they can only do this by keeping the taxes these business pay at lower levels) ... which translates into hiring more workers ... = more jobs.
The lending industry is coming apart because of a law put into place during the Clinton administration that tore down some of the laws that separated banking from investments (which was put in place after the great depression in 1929 to prevent another crash).
Something that is hardly ever mentioned in terms of Wall Street ... we now have the first of the baby boomers entering into retirement ... which means they are pulling money out of their investments ( the stock market) to money markets and CDs ... which brings the stock prices down.
_____________________________
I pray that you, being rooted and established in love, may have power, together with all the saints, to grasp how wide and long and high and deep is the love of Christ.
< Linus w/ a friends baby!
http://piswa.blogspot.com/
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 9:30:46 AM
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P31W
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I believe both McCain and Obama are being a little too extreme.
The truth is in "my opinion" is that the fundamentals are doing OK. Not great and not terrible just OK>
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 9:37:10 AM
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Stratplayer
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I am an Obama supporter...BUT I have to admit; the attack on McCain about his statement regarding fundamentals of the economy are sensatinalist. Yes, things are a bit uncomfortable right now and there are some major problems to fix for sure, but we are not on the verge of callapsing (and believe me, I am not financially "well off" either). Obama: please stop grabbing at straws.
_____________________________
Be anxious for nothing, but in everything by prayer and supplication, with thanksgiving, let your requests be made known to God; and the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus. (Phil. 4:6-7
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 9:44:37 AM
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relady
Posts: 1279
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quote:
I simply cannot stand to listen to Obama complain and talk down America. I don't know where you are hearing that. I listen to him and I hear him say how great America is and that we can make it greater! I just love it when reality and truth are called pessimism.
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 9:47:18 AM
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Born_Again
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quote:
ORIGINAL: P31W
I believe both McCain and Obama are being a little too extreme.
The truth is in "my opinion" is that the fundamentals are doing OK. Not great and not terrible just OK>
Would you please educate me and tell me what are the fundamental of economy?
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 9:48:08 AM
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relady
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quote:
The lending industry is coming apart because of a law put into place during the Clinton administration that tore down some of the laws that separated banking from investments (which was put in place after the great depression in 1929 to prevent another crash) Actually, it was a law that was repealed in 1998. Yes, Clinton was in the Whitehouse but who was running Congress??? Let me think....Oh yeah, that would be the Republicans, who never met a regulatory law they didn't want to deregulate. This one gets laid squarely at the conservatives' feet.
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 9:51:51 AM
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Psalms274
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quote:
ORIGINAL: relady
quote:
The lending industry is coming apart because of a law put into place during the Clinton administration that tore down some of the laws that separated banking from investments (which was put in place after the great depression in 1929 to prevent another crash) Actually, it was a law that was repealed in 1998. Yes, Clinton was in the Whitehouse but who was running Congress??? Let me think....Oh yeah, that would be the Republicans, who never met a regulatory law they didn't want to deregulate. This one gets laid squarely at the conservatives' feet.
It is the fault of both parties ...
The point I was attempting to make is the problem lies with both parties ... the legislation Republican slant) for creating a bill that got to the Presidents desk and the President (a Democrat) for signing it.
_____________________________
I pray that you, being rooted and established in love, may have power, together with all the saints, to grasp how wide and long and high and deep is the love of Christ.
< Linus w/ a friends baby!
http://piswa.blogspot.com/
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 10:02:06 AM
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relady
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Clinton could have vetoed it and made them override the veto, which would have happened. And had Clinton veoted it he would have been accuse of being "obstructionist". This bill was NOT a bipartisan effort. All three of its sponsors were Republicans. The Republicans were running the show. I'm really more interested in how McCain voted, since he was in the Senate at that time. I believe, at least on the initial vote, he voted for it. He's a deregulator just like the rest - we do not need more deregulation.
In any case, the point now is who has the best plan to fix it. And do you trust the guy who was there and most likely voted for it in the first place to be the one to fix it? I don't.
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 10:10:46 AM
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P31W
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quote:
Would you please educate me and tell me what are the fundamental of economy?
I am trying to find a good source to reply to this question. An economics source that is non-bias. So far I have come up empty handed. I want my reply to you to be one that comes actual facts not fear or political garbage.
I am still seaching. I hope to find a good source of information before I have to leave.
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 10:16:52 AM
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P31W
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quote:
And do you trust the guy who was there and most likely voted for it in the first place to be the one to fix it?
So you are guessing? That's how you make decisions or are you just "trying" to jab McCain?
Never mind. I think most of us know the truth.
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 10:17:58 AM
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blue1914
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Stratplayer
I am an Obama supporter...BUT I have to admit; the attack on McCain about his statement regarding fundamentals of the economy are sensatinalist. Yes, things are a bit uncomfortable right now and there are some major problems to fix for sure, but we are not on the verge of callapsing (and believe me, I am not financially "well off" either). Obama: please stop grabbing at straws.
Please define "verge of collapsing"?
Our national debt is greater than 60% of our GDP. We are one of the few nations on earth that can say that.
Our manufacturing growth is almost nil-the majority of our economy is made up of service based industries-what does that mean-when people can no longer afford to purchase staples (short and long term durable goods) they start cutting back on services. If a major economy is made up of mainly services, what does that mean?
Economies (sustainable ones that is) must be built upon a cycle-work is created when manufacturers manufacture and a consumer base for those manufactured goods is created when those workers consume those manufactured goods. America decided to short circuit the system and become the world's "merchants" and have the world as our "workers".
Since the world's "workers" cannot afford American products, the customer base in America needs to be able to absorb the cheap products from the "workers". Only they can't-they don't have jobs, remember? Their purchase power is now based in China, India, Thailand, etc. etc. - but those people can't afford to purchase the goods they produce on behalf of the American market "merchants". It's an unsustainable system at it's base.
Mr. Obama may have indeed played up the sensational "today" aspect of the effects everyone can see, but the point is sound-the economic fundamentals of the current American system are NOT sound nor sustainable. Does that mean that the bubble will burst tomorrow-probably not, but it's only a matter of time-removing enough jobs from the American economic "ecosystem" is removing the consumer market. That will eventually come home to rest.
The only problem I find is that neither Mr. Obama nor Mr. McCain are talking about the real cause of the problem nor the real solution. Either one will have a very hard time creating real solutions that will truly protect American industries-and for that, I am disappointed.
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 10:25:17 AM
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blue1914
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Born_Again
quote:
ORIGINAL: P31W
I believe both McCain and Obama are being a little too extreme.
The truth is in "my opinion" is that the fundamentals are doing OK. Not great and not terrible just OK>
Would you please educate me and tell me what are the fundamental of economy?
This was not aimed at me, but I did want to give an opinion.
At it's "fundamentals" an economy is made up of buyers and sellers. Ideally the system should be symbiotic-sellers should manufacture the goods and services the buyers need and the buyers should have the ability to purchase those goods.
Of course on a larger scale, this becomes a "circle" - the sellers employ the buyers to create their products and services, the buyers use the income they receive from the sellers to purchase products for the seller, thereby making more work for themselves to create more goods and services, etc.
Now, what happens when we have the American model-the work to produce goods and services are sent off-shore and another economy reaps the benefit of the income that comes from making goods and services? How sustainable can that system be? Who will ultimately benefit from a system like that? - only the people at the top of the system, not those who need to create income to purchase goods and services.
What we are seeing today is the beginning of the inevitable result of such an unsustainable system.
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 10:27:13 AM
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iluvatar
Posts: 1931
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quote:
ORIGINAL: relady
Clinton could have vetoed it and made them override the veto, which would have happened. And had Clinton veoted it he would have been accuse of being "obstructionist". This bill was NOT a bipartisan effort. All three of its sponsors were Republicans. The Republicans were running the show. I'm really more interested in how McCain voted, since he was in the Senate at that time. I believe, at least on the initial vote, he voted for it. He's a deregulator just like the rest - we do not need more deregulation.
The Senate vote was completely down party lines. The House vote was more bipartisan. IIRC almost all Republicans voted for it (something like 7 voted against), whereas the Democrats voted 155-51 in favor (those numbers are approximate, I can't find the site right now).
-Dan.
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Well, I've been to one world fair, a picnic, and a rodeo, and that's the stupidest thing I ever heard come over a set of earphones.
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 10:34:34 AM
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relady
Posts: 1279
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quote:
It would have been impossible for a veto to be overridden without Democrat support. The Republicans NEVER had a sufficient majority to override a veto. Well, there are always some defectors -- on both sides. Clinton should have vetoed it. But that's not the point now. The point is....it was a completely Republican effort in that all three sponsors/writers were Republican -- and one of the guys running for President voted for it. And now he wants us to let him fix it. Yeah.
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 10:46:44 AM
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P31W
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quote:
The point is....it was a completely Republican effort
A Democratic president signed it into law.
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 10:49:37 AM
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relady
Posts: 1279
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quote:
A Democratic president signed it into law. At this point I'm more concerned that someone who voted FOR it is running for president, asking us to let him fix it.
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 10:54:30 AM
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Psalms274
Posts: 1101
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From: Georgia
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quote:
ORIGINAL: relady
quote:
A Democratic president signed it into law. At this point I'm more concerned that someone who voted FOR it is running for president, asking us to let him fix it.
He did not vote for it ... see previous post.
_____________________________
I pray that you, being rooted and established in love, may have power, together with all the saints, to grasp how wide and long and high and deep is the love of Christ.
< Linus w/ a friends baby!
http://piswa.blogspot.com/
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 10:56:00 AM
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csl7037
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Is "McClain" a slam I don't get? Why do I keep seeing "McClain"?
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RE: New Obama "Fundamentals" Ad - 9/17/2008 11:01:17 AM
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relady
Posts: 1279
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From: Greater St. Louis Metro
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quote:
He did not vote for it ... see previous post. Wrong Bill. The one that repealed Glass Steagall was S.900 and McCain voted FOR it.
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