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A false Anointing? - 11/15/2008 11:21:49 AM
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rolling
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Query: Is there a false anointing that seems so like the real deal yet it is not? I have experienced a lot of strange situations through the years that prompts me to put forth this question.
Or...does the anointing of the Spirit follow a man or woman in ministry who is living a double life or doing things that smacks of corruption? I'm not saying a person has to be perfect in every way in order to have an anointed ministry. I'm talking about some real off the chart sins.
I'm also talking about desperately off the chart false doctrine.
Also, off the chart arrogance and avarice. We all know of such ministers and many of them seem to have a free pass and are blessed in every way....it seems. Which only may prove that the depth of ones spiritual maturity cannot be measured by outward success.
Again. The initial question. Is there a false 'anointing' that even the very elect might fall for if not for the grace of God...and discernment?
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RE: A false Anointing? - 11/15/2008 11:46:08 AM
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BenQuebec
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Anything God creates can and will be imitated. My three cents Canadian...
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RE: A false Anointing? - 11/15/2008 12:39:48 PM
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csl7037
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I think there are imitators or even those who might be deceived believing they have an annointing when they do not. I also believe many truly annointed people fall into some real "off the charts" sin. Sad but true. Sin is sin and I don't think God sees certain ones as being "off the charts". IMO, the real test is in the doctrine. Someone with unBiblical doctrine is absolutely a false prophet or teacher and is, again, either faking an annointing or is deceived. Of course, doctrinal issues are up for debate and some will argue all day that something is in the Bible even though it just doesn't hold water - and lots of Christians are deceived. We've got to be discerning because you really can only make that determination based on God's Word and the Holy Spirit (and some measure of common sense is helpful); you can't label someone "false" by their outward sin, fruit, or lack thereof.
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RE: A false Anointing? - 11/15/2008 3:42:36 PM
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1love1God1way
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There is only one anointing, and that is the Holy Spirit coming into a person's life. This teaching of different kinds of anointings or double anointings is false.
If a person claims to be a Christian, and yet bears bad fruit . . . Well, Scripture is clear about those kinds of people. Cf. Matthew 7.
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RE: A false Anointing? - 11/15/2008 5:31:40 PM
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pbaribeault
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There are no such things as false ministers. There are real ministers and there are liars.
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RE: A false Anointing? - 11/15/2008 6:17:17 PM
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rolling
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False prophets comes to mind.
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RE: A false Anointing? - 11/15/2008 8:43:55 PM
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earthless
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For us New Testament believers (meaning we know we are not Jews living in the Old Testament), the word 'anointed' has two meanings.
The first one is regarding Jesus Christ as the "chosen one" (Luke 4:18-19, Acts 10:38). When Jesus left the earth, He left us the gift of the Holy Spirit (John 14:6) - now all Christians, all those who are born-again, are anointed, chosen for the specific purpose of furthering God's Kingdom (1 John 2:20).
Sadly and strangely enough, out of ignorance and emotional appeal, many in various church circles today have taken the word 'anointing' and turned it into something erroneous.
In describing a certain pastor or preacher, they will comment with "so and so has a double portion of the anointing...." or "send in $1,000 and I will impart my anointing to you, you will become my armor bearer!"
When you are a born-again believer you are anointed. And you cannot get double portions of salvation nor can someone "impart" their anointing to you.
"Now He who establishes us with you in Christ and has anointed us is God, who also has sealed us and given us the Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee" (2 Corinthians 1:21-22).
_____________________________
Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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RE: A false Anointing? - 11/16/2008 9:47:13 PM
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jn1010lf
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Hello rolling
Yes, there certainly is a false anointing. I've usually found that if one tries to convince everyone that the anointing is on him or her it generally isn't.
The only way I could counsel here is to look closely at the ministry of Jesus. How were people convinced that He was the Son of God? How did He raise money? What was His attitude toward people?
Another way to discern if a person has a false anointing is whether or not he or she forces things on you.
As for the type of people you mentioned if their lives are not holy, I personally wouldn't listen to them.
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RE: A false Anointing? - 11/18/2008 1:04:10 PM
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RJR_fan
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quote:
Is there a false anointing that seems so like the real deal yet it is not?
Well, cults that deny the Trinity, such as the United Pentecostals ("Jesus-only") seem to rely upon an overheated human spirit as a substitute for the ministry of the Holy Spirit. This false "anointing" is overbearing, rude, intrusive, forceful. It is also highly energized, and very exciting to the one experiencing it. If you see someone disrupting a prayer service with emotional ejaculations, who appears to be more excited about being excited than he is about being in God's presence, check out the doctrinal background of the disruptive person. An exorcism may be in order.
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Blogging my way through the Turkish New Testament
Meet my beloved mentor, RJR
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RE: A false Anointing? - 11/19/2008 6:58:38 PM
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DuckTalk
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A false annointing would be one who masqaurades as a angel of light, but they are actually followers of the dark.
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Sufferin' sassafrass. The nerve of some people, profitting from other people's miseries.
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RE: A false Anointing? - 12/3/2008 9:51:32 AM
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speak_n_it
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I know that the Bible says that the gifts and callings of God are without repentance. I just read an article written by J. Lee Grady this morning that stated "Ministers of the gospel need both godly character and powerful anointing. Why did we ever settle for the idea that we should have one without the other."
I recently left a church where the Pastor had a very bad temper. He was very abusive to his immediate family. His mindset was that he was anointed and no one else was. He had emotionally abused his wife for years and started physically abusing her and their children. She filed for divorce and now he is telling everyone that she is in a mid life crisis. He is still in the pulpit and still preaching.
So I would also like to know at what point is enough, enough?
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RE: A false Anointing? - 12/3/2008 9:55:12 AM
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1love1God1way
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quote:
ORIGINAL: speak_n_it
I know that the Bible says that the gifts and callings of God are without repentance. I just read an article written by J. Lee Grady this morning that stated "Ministers of the gospel need both godly character and powerful anointing. Why did we ever settle for the idea that we should have one without the other."
Every believer has a "powerful anointing." It's called the Holy Spirit.
quote:
I recently left a church where the Pastor had a very bad temper. He was very abusive to his immediate family. His mindset was that he was anointed and no one else was. He had emotionally abused his wife for years and started physically abusing her and their children. She filed for divorce and now he is telling everyone that she is in a mid life crisis. He is still in the pulpit and still preaching.
So I would also like to know at what point is enough, enough?
Seeing as you left the church . . . you found your point when it was enough. Props to you.
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love.ben
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RE: A false Anointing? - 12/3/2008 11:16:49 AM
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rolling
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I remember reading a letter from David Wilkerson years ago. A young man had written him the following. " David, why is that when you are finally persuaded by the guy behind the pulpit and you surrender all, you spend months in bible study and prayer shutting out everything worldly, God anoints you with your gifts and functions then all of a sudden you are no longer welcome by that man behind the pulpit?? You find yourself isolated and rejected by the leadership and many in the congregation. You are then forced to leave and find another church only to find the same thing there...why?'
Answer: It's a no brainer. The 'church is out of order. The N.T. mould was broken 1700 years ago. It is no longer relevant. The Spirit was quenced long ago by man's intrusion of God's place in our midst. One man is exalted and gushed over by those 'who love it so'. I've covered this subject in the Salaries?' section.
By the way, I experienced this same treatment for decades by the 'anointed leaders'.
Conclusion: There is a false anointing that is more of a natural 'charisma'. It use to blow my friend Rocky outta the water for the same decades. He has a deep 'Sam Elliot' voice and looks like a cross between Stallone and Elliot. He never surrendered all to Christ. He told me so, but every church he ever went to the folks about fell out of the pews when he walked through the doors. Within a couple of weeks he'd be teaching adult sunday school. If he ever hung around for at least a year, he'd be senior pastor.
Rocky told me one time, 'everywhere i go, the people think I'm Paul for some reason.'
This drove him to backslide. He couldn't mantain stardom forever. He smokes, drinks etc.etc.
My story is the opposite. I'd spend years building up my relationship with God only to be 'cold shouldered' everywhere I'd venture in the realms of christendom. No pity pot here. Thank God I was 'cast outta the synagogue'. I do not want to be a partaker of the same sins. I have enough problems already. 
Are there 2 scenarios present...yep! devon and kathy
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RE: A false Anointing? - 12/4/2008 12:48:45 PM
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IMA_CHRISTIAN
Posts: 1700
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quote:
ORIGINAL: RJR_fan
quote:
Is there a false anointing that seems so like the real deal yet it is not?
Well, cults that deny the Trinity, such as the United Pentecostals ("Jesus-only") seem to rely upon an overheated human spirit as a substitute for the ministry of the Holy Spirit. This false "anointing" is overbearing, rude, intrusive, forceful. It is also highly energized, and very exciting to the one experiencing it. If you see someone disrupting a prayer service with emotional ejaculations, who appears to be more excited about being excited than he is about being in God's presence, check out the doctrinal background of the disruptive person. An exorcism may be in order.
oh my goodness! this might explain something. back about 2 years ago when i attended a oneness church, the minister was so "anointed" and so passionate. i mean as if he was for real. i sat thru a bunch of services and sermons and he seemed so real.. what he preached was good,, but then in the back of my mind i remembered about doctrine. and i just could not understand how could he sound so real, so on fire for the Lord, so sincere, and so dedicated to the Lord, how could these things be???????? if anyone seemed like a real man of God it would be him. but that one doctrinal thing seemed to be the thing.
can someone really seem SOOOO sincere, so on fire, etc... i mean you would think he was a real true man of God, but then,, wrong doctrine,, that has to be the #1 concern.
if someone is good in every single way 99%, but that one percent means bad doctrine, would that qualify that person to be NOT a good man of God,, because of that one major heterodox doctrine?? that must be it.
_____________________________
Just give us peace, Lord.
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RE: A false Anointing? - 12/4/2008 5:40:18 PM
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oneGodonename
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I had a preacher tell me when I was speaking of someone else's anointing that he was the most anointed there in the church...I guess because he was the Pastor? Is that arrogance? I've been a member of this church for seven years (hmmm) and as the months go by, I'm wondering more and more if I belong there, but when I decided to leave I "heard a Word" so-to-speak telling me "not yet." I eneded up having to go on a Sunday to meet a friend of mine, and then the following Wednesday, and that's when the preacher preached from Galatians 3 which made me wonder was he going to preach that if he hadn't seen me before entering the pulpit. Anyway, what he said within the sermon made sense, but I just wonder if that was specifically for me. He knows me by name and I sent him an "exit letter" (real brief "I'm leaving, God bless"). Anyway, the way things go there is really questionable to me, and the leadership... I know several of the ministers and a couple pastors personally and...they just leave a lot to be desired as far as "being saved" is concerned. (not judging, just saying)
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RE: A false Anointing? - 12/7/2008 12:49:50 PM
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momma-mo
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It's sad when folks compare each others anointing. The Dave Wilkerson letter....I can relate to that....The church is out of whack when you get anointed and the leadership gets all weird about it and makes it uncomfortable for you. It's happened to me, and it is very sad....more for the church than me. Many churches stifle the spiritual gifts of the members. Too many work on the assumption that only the pastor is anointed and anyone else being anointed is unheard of and rebellion. Very sad indeed. Stifling the Holy Spirit can be a death sentence to a church.
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Jesus died and lived to tell about it!
Rapture: Separation of Church and state...
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RE: A false Anointing? - 12/7/2008 3:31:42 PM
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rcjames
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rolling
Query: Is there a false anointing that seems so like the real deal yet it is not?
Well here's sign; if someone has to tell you that they "have the anointing"; I would suggest you check your wallet and leave.
Do some folks seem to be better at speaking the oracles of God; yes. Do some folks seem to speak and it is absolutly the Oracles of God; Yes.
Does God "Anoint" certain folks to do certain things; Yes (See 1 Cor 12).
Does one need to tell folks that they are God's man for the occasion; No, that would be the flesh of the person speaking.
Do angels of darkness come as Angels of LIght and try to decieve; Yes they do;
(2Co 11:13) For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
(2Co 11:14) And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
(2Co 11:15) Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
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